Debate and Discussion

"Ohhh, is that me or you in your drawings and or story?"
Aurora Moon at 10:47PM, Aug. 5, 2007
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in a way, this proably should go into the art section, but on the other hand I kinda want to have this as a discussion. Snice it's more about how people react to our works rather than about our work. if that makes sense.

Anyway… getting to the point. Have you guys ever had people making all kinds of assumpations about your artwork and your comics? As in looking into it too deeply and saying things about your work that makes you go “huh?”.

let me tell you a example, which actually happened in real life to me. I was just starting up Endless dream…. and my boyfriend assumed that snice I was drawing some of my inspiration from my own dreams, that the main character had to be me. When I had told him at least once before that it wasn't me and that it was supposed to be it's OWN story, not just a story about my dreams.
And then he procceeded to assume that the guys that Janice (the main character) meets were some kind of dream guy that I wish I would had in real life or something. his own words were: “So I guess you have a thing for cute blonde guys.” to which I responded, “Uh, what?”

He's not the only one that has made such werid comments. Like when I wrote in first person for a fair amount of my stories/fanfiction and showed them to my family, they'd assume that I was litterally writing from my own viewpoint and that the main character in a way, was me even though the main character was a guy. so they'd just start to get worried if the main character had problems with his family, and then they'd ask me things like: “Is that how you see me?”

and sometimes when I doodled in high school back then, I'd be just drawing random people on the back of my test sheets or something when I was done with the tests. And then the teacher after she notices the drawings on the back of the paper, would ask: “So is this me?”
To which I'd respond: “No.”

This was just something I thought about recently… so have any of you ever had simlar expernices? What makes people think the way they do when it comes to thier loved ones' artwork and or writings?
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
mapaghimagsik at 12:14AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Sorry to read about your experience. Many people mis-interpret what I do, but sometimes they see something in it that I didn't notice before.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:51PM
Aurora Moon at 12:45AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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keep in mind it's not something that pisses me off or anything.

It's just something werid I've noticed. and I just wanted to get people's thoughts on why some people might look too deeply into a piece of artwork or story.

I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
Allan at 1:30AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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I get this a lot from my drawings (not my comics), where people always ask me, “Is this me,” and I say, “No.” “Well then who is it?” “It's just some random guy, lady! Get off my case!”

I try to make my comic as straightforward as I can, so that no one can misinterpret it. A few have, but when they do I try to clarify.
last edited on July 14, 2011 10:49AM
arteestx at 7:27AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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I remember reading an interview of Berke Breathed, the artist of Bloom County, saying how for years he never had any minorities or women in his comics. And the reason is becuase invariably people would assume that any minority or woman that showed up was a representation of ALL minorities. If a black person said something in his comic, somehow it was supposed to represent what all black people would say, or what Berke thought they would say. He eventually did incorporate minorities and women, but I can see people thinking and saying that to him.

As for your question, I think people think about that for the main reason that most people write what they know. If you write a character who is a jerk, you have to get in touch with your “inner jerk” to write. And let's face it, when you write something, it's coming from you somewhere somehow, and it's not unreasonable to think something may unconsciously bubble up.

We all have various aspects of our personality to draw from… we can be nice, mean, rude, hateful, loving, generous, greedy, and so forth. Of course, it doesn't mean that when you write for a “rude jerk” character it means you're a rude jerk yourself, or that you're writing what you “wish you could say” or something like that. But I don't completely dismiss the idea that what you write reveals things about yourself, intended or otherwise.

Xolta is not intended for anyone under 18 years old.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:02AM
mlai at 8:17AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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It's what ppl will assume in those Drunkduck round-robin fighting comics. Everyone assumes it's self-insertion. So if you want to insert a character and role-play that character, you better pick someone who is nice, likeable, and sportsmanlike.

FIGHT current chapter: Filling In The Gaps
FIGHT_2 current chapter: Light Years of Gold
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:05PM
Aurora Moon at 9:44AM, Aug. 6, 2007
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arteestx
I remember reading an interview of Berke Breathed, the artist of Bloom County, saying how for years he never had any minorities or women in his comics. And the reason is because invariably people would assume that any minority or woman that showed up was a representation of ALL minorities. If a black person said something in his comic, somehow it was supposed to represent what all black people would say, or what Berke thought they would say. He eventually did incorporate minorities and women, but I can see people thinking and saying that to him.

As for your question, I think people think about that for the main reason that most people write what they know. If you write a character who is a jerk, you have to get in touch with your “inner jerk” to write. And let's face it, when you write something, it's coming from you somewhere somehow, and it's not unreasonable to think something may unconsciously bubble up.

We all have various aspects of our personality to draw from… we can be nice, mean, rude, hateful, loving, generous, greedy, and so forth. Of course, it doesn't mean that when you write for a “rude jerk” character it means you're a rude jerk yourself, or that you're writing what you “wish you could say” or something like that. But I don't completely dismiss the idea that what you write reveals things about yourself, intended or otherwise.

If writers only wrote about the experiences they had, then what about the writers who write some expertly violent stories with detailed rape, mutilation, incest, etc?
Those same writers in real life doesn't know what it's like to be raped or to rape others. or to harm themselves and others. They did it though research and with a little imagination they made it seem realistic in the stories. And most imporantly They don't advocate rape or incest for that matter.
So it doesn't make sense that an writer who wrote about a rape victim coping with her/his trama would NEED to be raped in order to write about such a thing. otherwise, how could she/he write what he/she doesn't know personally?

I've wrote stories about child abuse, rape and all that nasty stuff. Yet, I've never had any of that happen. I don't know what such things feels like and I hope I never will. But I've had people online tell me how some of the stuff seemed so realstic and stuff.

So I would have to say that no, Stories and or the artwork does not nessicarly relfect the Writer/Artist's life or tastes at all. sometimes the way I draw certain things like super hot, sexy women makes it seem like I'm 1)A man or a 2)Lesbain. But I'm not any of those two. I just like drawing sexy women in revealing clothing which leaves little to the imagination.

So if the Artwork makes the artist, I wonder what that makes me.
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
Vindibudd at 12:27PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Aurora Moon
Anyway… getting to the point. Have you guys ever had people making all kinds of assumpations about your artwork and your comics? As in looking into it too deeply and saying things about your work that makes you go “huh?”.


My ex girlfriend always insisted I was Vindibudd even after multiple explanations to the contrary. She was a really stupid person.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
arteestx at 8:12PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Aurora Moon
If writers only wrote about the experiences they had, then what about the writers who write some expertly violent stories with detailed rape, mutilation, incest, etc?
Those same writers in real life doesn't know what it's like to be raped or to rape others. or to harm themselves and others. They did it though research and with a little imagination they made it seem realistic in the stories. And most imporantly They don't advocate rape or incest for that matter.

…..So if the Artwork makes the artist, I wonder what that makes me.

You misunderstand my point. I agree entirely with everything you said. You don't have to rape someone to write about rape. You don't have to travel to alien worlds to write science fiction. You don't *have* to do research to write a story about pirates. So you're right, what you write about doesn't have to come from your own experiences.

But what I do say is that *how* you write can be revealing. When you write about rape, you do have to write the words for that character. You don't have to rape someone to write powerful or realistic words, but those words do have to come from within you. It does come from a dark place inside you. Doesn't mean you'll do it. Doesn't mean you secretly think it's nifty to rape people. But you are putting your own twist, your own imagination, a little bit of you in that story.

And it's not like there's only one way for a writer to write. You can write an emotionally wrenching rape story that doesn't have focus on the sex. You can write a scene that does focus on the sex. You can write a horror story. You can write a sci fi story. You can write a cliche parody story. And one writer could write all of these. But they all will come from within the writer. And, as such, will reflect aspects of the writer's thoughts, feelings, and personalities.

I don't know if I'm being clear. Let me put it to you this way… if you gave the same plot, characters, and specific scences to ten different people and told them to write a story, you'd get ten different stories. Let's say they're all good stories, well-written, thought-provoking works of art. But they're still ten different stories. What would be the differences? And where do those differences come from? I would argue that the differences are reflections of the different personalities of the writers… not their experiences per se, not their wishes per se, not their secret desires per se. But the differences among those people will be reflected in how they write the story. That's my only point.

Xolta is not intended for anyone under 18 years old.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:02AM
Rusty Knight at 8:15PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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I have stuff like that happen to me too.

Mom: You always did like big breasted women

Me (While drawing Kenya): What?

Mom: The girl you're drawing.

Me: I really can't think of a good way to answer that Mom.

What made THAT so hard was it was my Mom. Some people assume that Roland is based off of myself. Which isn't too far from the truth. There's a bunch of different characters that are based off of myself. But none of them are completely me. All different parts. Most of my characters, I came up with while listening to a particular song. The character I'm most like hasn't been drawn in a comic at all.

People think like that, mostly because of Brain Dead English teachers who will read any line in a book, fold it closed, then ask the class. “Now what did the author mean by that line?” “HOW THE HELL DO YOU KNOW THE AUTHOR MEANT ANYTHING BY THAT LINE!?”

“Common Folk” seem to have this idea that inspiration can ONLY come from real life experiences. That a good story can never just be made up.
I'm Jon. You can call me Dr. Jon… but I prefer Jon since I'm not really a Doctor.

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:12PM
Aurora Moon at 8:31PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Rusty Knight
think like that, mostly because of Brain Dead English teachers who will read any line in a book, fold it closed, then ask the class. “Now what did the author mean by that line?” “HOW THE HELL DO YOU KNOW THE AUTHOR MEANT ANYTHING BY THAT LINE!?”

LOL, I hated classes like that. while it's true that some writers out there wanted to make people think and crap, sometimes there's writers who just wanted to write a good story that people would love, without any of that hidden meanings crap.

I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
Hawk at 8:42PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Art teachers are worse. They'll go deep into the meanings of paintings, while I'm just thinking, “How do you know? Maybe he just wanted to paint a bowl of fruit.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
Rusty Knight at 8:54PM, Aug. 6, 2007
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Hawk
Art teachers are worse. They'll go deep into the meanings of paintings, while I'm just thinking, “How do you know? Maybe he just wanted to paint a bowl of fruit.”
I remember my fifth grade teacher in THIS flash back.

Teacher: “Now does anyone know why the statue is naked?”

Class giggles but no one raises a hand.

Teacher: “Well, he was naked because the artist wanted to capture the true essence of man.”

Little Jon raises his hand

Teacher: “Yes Jon?”

Jon: “It's actually because the artist was gay.” (Which was actually true).
I'm Jon. You can call me Dr. Jon… but I prefer Jon since I'm not really a Doctor.

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:12PM
MagickLorelai at 6:39AM, Aug. 7, 2007
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I do a semi-autobiographical comic. It started off as a self-insert, but ended up blowing up into WAY more than I expected, and the character that originally represented me completely changed. She's not me. What she does is actually separate from what I do.

But…EVERYONE inserts themselves into their stories/comics. Their characters are parts of themselves, extensions of some part of their mind. They're not the whole of the person, just parts here and there.

last edited on July 14, 2011 1:50PM
TnTComic at 6:42AM, Aug. 7, 2007
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Hawk
Art teachers are worse. They'll go deep into the meanings of paintings, while I'm just thinking, “How do you know? Maybe he just wanted to paint a bowl of fruit.”

Man that sums up how I felt most of the time in art/english class.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:31PM
Rori at 4:53PM, Aug. 7, 2007
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I agree that your stories are part of you, even if they aren't in anyway autobiographical. After all, if they weren't, where would they come from? (Unless you believe it is possible for something beyond you to use you as a conductor.)

However, I've had lots of experiences with people assuming they are this or that character. I guess it stems from the human need for flattery on one hand, and the need to “solve” the mystery a unique character creates. It's even more difficult because most people do draw heavily on their own experiences to write, even if things are switched around to the point most wouldn't recognize the real-life inspirations. But a well-rounded character may be inspired by a dozen different people you've interacted with, plus stuff you just seem to pull out of the ether. Maybe it's just easier to say “oh, I know that's so-and-so” than understand that it's only so-and-so's nose ;)
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:11PM
spacehamster at 5:23PM, Aug. 7, 2007
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I guess when it's people that are close to you, it's understandable to an extent. They know you fairly well, so naturally they're going to look for connections between your art and what they know about you.

I think what people don't realize is that usually what we express in our art is the things we cannot express otherwise, and what they're looking at is probably a part of us they don't know at all.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
marine at 5:26PM, Aug. 7, 2007
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My comics can and have literally polarize audiences. My forum posts confuse perceptions and cause bursts of laughter. I always attempt to put some mentions of news topics and current events, but I don't want my comics to be dated. Anyway, people have called me all sorts of things:

Gay
Homophobic
Republcian
Democrat
Gamer
Liberal
Conservative
Retarded
Offensive
Vulgar
Obscene
Racist
Sexist
Elitist

and so many other labels and names you could put to a guy.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:52PM
Runosonta at 9:43AM, Aug. 9, 2007
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arteestx
I remember reading an interview of Berke Breathed, the artist of Bloom County, saying how for years he never had any minorities or women in his comics. And the reason is becuase invariably people would assume that any minority or woman that showed up was a representation of ALL minorities. If a black person said something in his comic, somehow it was supposed to represent what all black people would say, or what Berke thought they would say.
I have that same problem. I just don't want to give wrong impressions… Gah! Hope I'll eventually grow out of it.

My experiences:
- a friend of mine with a loud voice (and a bad memory) decided that all the men I draw were my ex. And he yelled it out loud every friggin time, for over an year. Everyone thought I had an obsession of some sort -_-;

- teachers finding some imaginery phony deep shite from my “art”

- mum deciding I have problems when I was a kid and wrote a short novel of a horse who lost his father :DD



I DO write myself in the story. In a way. All the main values are always mine. The main character is a person I would like. It's about thing I'm interested in, with my humour and beliefs. Etcetera.

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:12PM
Hawk at 5:11PM, Aug. 9, 2007
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You know, thinking about this topic more deeply, I think it may actually be a good thing for people to look at your characters and be reminded of people they know. I might actually mean you character is deep and dimensional enough to compare to real people. It's sort of like a caricature where where you can actually tell who it is.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
skoolmunkee at 6:18PM, Aug. 9, 2007
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Aurora Moon
LOL, I hated classes like that. while it's true that some writers out there wanted to make people think and crap, sometimes there's writers who just wanted to write a good story that people would love, without any of that hidden meanings crap.

That reminds me of my 10th grade English teacher, whenever she would ask the class what parts of the book meant, apparently my interpretations were always wrong and not what the author meant at all. It seems anything can only mean one thing at a time. She would get pretty worked up about it. Eventually I started doing it on purpose because it was funny. Though it did get annoying when she moved my desk to the front row so she could bang on my desk and waggle her finger in my face (she always had a band-aid on it, and it was always falling off). Memories. :)

I never really had the ‘is that me’ problem, instead I had the ‘use MY idea in your comic!’ problem. But I don't WANT to use your idea, I want to use mine! T_T
  IT'S OLD BATMAN
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:40PM
EmilyTheStrange at 8:02PM, Aug. 9, 2007
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Everyone thinks I'm Tabbi because we “look so much alike.”
Really though the only things we share is short hair and green eyes (and mine are more on the brown side while hers are bright green.) We're both pale but I'm no where near as pale as her. XD Coinsidently everyone thinks that, because I'm obviously Tabbi, Crow must be my dream guy. Thats not true at all, I like Tadhg a LOT more (and if I were Tabbi that'd be some incest right thar~)

I've cleared up the fact that I'm not my main character with most people, but sometimes my mom still greets me with “Good Morning Tabbi! : D”

>>'

I will admit I write some of myself into all my characters and two or three of them are based off real people (only one has been introduced so far) but that was on purpose, they all know. XD

But lately, more often than people asking if so'so is so'so in my comic I get asked if they're supposed to sound British because “that's how I imagine their voices sounding. British.”
I guess I fail at typeing like an American. xD;
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:21PM
Rusty Knight at 9:19PM, Aug. 9, 2007
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Hawk
You know, thinking about this topic more deeply, I think it may actually be a good thing for people to look at your characters and be reminded of people they know. I might actually mean you character is deep and dimensional enough to compare to real people. It's sort of like a caricature where where you can actually tell who it is.
Actually, that's exactly what makes a character loveable and popular. If the reader can relate to them in some way. Or if they can't, if the character is or does something that the reader WANTS to do.

EDIT: Y'know, this whole conversation brings back an idea I had for a while, to insert myself, and my movie making crew into Thompson Gunners. Nothing special, more like a cameo. But now I think I'll make them have regular cameos.
I'm Jon. You can call me Dr. Jon… but I prefer Jon since I'm not really a Doctor.

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:12PM
TehDante at 4:20PM, Aug. 14, 2007
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Haha the most embarrassing experience I've had with that was actually just last week. I went on a brief vacation with my ex to Maine so she could be there for her family reunion. So naturally, I'm not part of the family, so I'm kind of an unnecassary wheel, to say the least. They're playing a big card game, so I sat in the corner and was doodling. One of her uncles leans over and starts talking about my drawing, saying that it looks like Scott, my ex's cousin. And humbly I repeated that it was just a random guy and he just kept insisting that it looked like “Scott as a Vulcan” (the guy had pointed ears). And then Scott comes walking in and the uncle insists that he come over and look at how he'd look as a Vulcan, rather loudly so as to get just about everyone's attention @_@ So yeah, that was unpleasant. I don't want to look like I'm obsessed with the guy, and I'm not sure if these people knew of my sexual orientation, so that was awkward.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:08PM
deletedbyrequest03 at 5:11PM, Aug. 14, 2007
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You know, Aurora, your situation is a really hard thing to go through.

In my comic, I have stereotypes of high school students, and tend to exaggerate and make fun of a few things (which prove a point). I actually have a few friends that fill the position of the same stereotypes as the characters in my story.

Thus, I don't tell them about it. I'm scared that what happened to you will happen to me.

Just to let you know, I seriously don't intend on making fun of them, or anyone. The thought of them didn't even come up as I wrote the story. It just happened to fall into place. I wrote the story for the purpose of bringing my point to high school society. Meaning, I'm making fun of myself. (Kinda.)

Some of my friends aren't into comics. They're just not. In fact, they make fun of me for it. (I know, complete bull, isn't it? Get new friends, they say! I can't, damn it! They stick like glue!) Thus, as I said before, I don't tell them about it. Simple as that. I don't have a big mouth.

That's only because I can't take their lip. My comic doesn't even represent my life (only the fact that I'm in high school). I mean, I currently don't have any main characters that are girls. Meaning it has nothing to do with me. I can bet all of you guys a big effing wad of cash that if I told some friends about my comic, they will ask that gorgeous question: Is that me in your comic? (Or, in other words) Are you making fun of me or something?

I try to tell them that it's not true, and being sensitive pussies, they call me a stupid bitch and walk away.

It's funny how we're talking about this, because I was actually afraid that a few friends of mine would discover this comic. I'm not scared anymore, because I've been here for a while, so it's probably not bound to happen.

I hope.

This year, school's full of BS!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:05PM
mapaghimagsik at 5:13PM, Aug. 14, 2007
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I think drawing from real life adds a richness and a genuineness to the comic. I don't think its a big deal to know your friends show aspects of certain characters, as long as you know which stereotype you'd fit in with as well. :D
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:51PM
crazyninny at 12:09PM, Aug. 22, 2007
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It seems that you have a lot of vain people around you. All of them seem to assume that a character you draw, or a story you write is based on them. I recomend that you should put some where a disclaimer that says
'This is a made up story with made up characters. No characters or events are based off of anyone or any events that ever happend that I know of.' Or something like that. People should start to figure out that your ideas are orginal, and as long as you make sure they understand that the characters and events aren't based around them, they should start seeing that its not them your writting about. ^_^
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:48AM
7384395948urhfdjfrueruieieueue at 3:02PM, Aug. 22, 2007
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marine
Gay
Homophobic
Republcian
Democrat
Gamer
Liberal
Conservative
Retarded
Offensive
Vulgar
Obscene
Racist
Sexist
Elitist

and so many other labels and names you could put to a guy.
Gamer?

i will also like to know you the more
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:04AM

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