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Date rape movie, 'edgy' or retarded?
Skullbie at 6:20PM, April 10, 2009
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Observe and Report is a movie that displays date rape in a ‘comedic’ light.

women and hollywood
http://womenandhollywood.com/2009/04/sexism-watch-date-rape-gets-mainstream-film-release/

Over the last day I’ve started to notice some disturbing posts about the film and date rape. So I forced myself to watch the trailer and there for all the world to see is Seth Rogen raping the passed out Anna Faris (a woman who is supposed to protect from a streaker.) She is clearly not able to make a conscious decision, her eyes are closed and there is a trail of vomit on the pillow. She is being raped but since it’s a comedy they can mitigate it by giving Rogen a moment where his brain goes huh maybe she’s unconscious and stops pumping briefly only to hear Faris shout out something like “Why are you stopping motherf***er?” Like that makes it ok. Passed out screaming implies consent. Bad premise.

I’m just wondering what some guys will think about when they come out of this film. We all know there is so much sexual violence perpetrated against women that having a film like this treat this epidemic so lightly is shocking.

The message is that date rape is appropriate comic fodder for a mainstream Hollywood comedy. This film makes Knocked Up’s sexism mild.

Tiger Beatdown sums it up best:

maybe I’ve reached the precise point at which I cannot be a “good sport” any longer and that is the point at which I am asked to pay ten fucking dollars plus however much a soda is these days for a movie that may very well insult me and every woman who’s ever had an unwanted dick shoved into her body. I could talk about how, even though I got warned in advance, even though I won’t be seeing the movie, the incredible frequency of rape and sexual assault in our society means that many, many victims of rape will see it, and the PTSD that often accompanies rape will mean that, for a joke, for some dipshit filmmaker’s attempt at being edgy, they are going to experience all of the pain and psychological trauma associated with that experience, they are going to feel that rape all over again, there, in their seats, in the theater, and they are going to pay for the experience, and if they try to talk about what that filmmaker did to them it’s probably going to get sidetracked into some conversation about the Sanctity of Art which is invariably given more consideration than their actual lives.


Sexism in films is nothing new to me, but the part i bolded in that article really got to me that movies like this just aren't worth making. :/
What do you think?
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:47PM
Freegurt at 6:43PM, April 10, 2009
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Wow, that's….wow.

I've had my fun with offensive movies and shows. I mean, I've had my beliefs take a blow from the media and I take it in good stride. You know, “Haha, it's horrible but so true, hahaa.”

But this looks to me like the director drunkenly flopped right over the “offensive humor” line and just landed in the “blatant retardation” part of the room. :\

Plus, I'm getting tired of all of these sex comedy movies that have been popping up lately. Give me movies that don't make me want to choke a small, adorable kitten.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:31PM
BffSatan at 9:45PM, April 10, 2009
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Yeah, it's totally ok to make fun of the mentaly disabled, but rape humour is not cool.

Double-freaking-standards.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:20AM
Skullbie at 10:52PM, April 10, 2009
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Date raping the mentally disabled, ‘edgy’ or retarded?
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:47PM
lba at 12:40AM, April 11, 2009
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Essentially, it seems to me that part of the movie might not have been entirely a wise choice, but it's hardly the first time Hollywood has played on the “bad choice while blacked out” bit. It happened in the movie Beerfest where a male character got too drunk and ended up in a slightly dominatrix-like sex bit, and I can't recall anyone flipping out over that. There have been numerous other examples of people making stupid choices in other movies too. It just strikes me that this is one of those cases where it's ok to pull an incredibly similar stunt with a guy as the victim, but not a woman. I watched the trailer, and I didn't see any shots of him dumping rophynol into her drink so for all I know it's the exact same as the Beerfest scene but with the roles reversed.

It happens a lot in Hollywood in a number of different cases and ways and I treat it the same way as people who are willing to take shots at others but not pull any. It's a double standard, and while I do agree that there are better ways to make people laugh, I think people either need to recognize the double standard or I reserve the right to ignore their argument.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:29PM
Custard Trout at 12:41AM, April 11, 2009
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Skullbie
Date raping the mentally disabled, ‘edgy’ or retarded?

Edgetarded.
Hey buddy, you should be a Russian Cosmonaut, and here's why.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:02PM
ozoneocean at 12:54AM, April 11, 2009
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I dunno, I suppose you'd have to actually see the film to say for sure.

I've gotten up on a high horse many times about this of that thing without actually seeing it for real, just based on what I've heard. It's fun, but you're only right about 50% of the time.

See and then judge.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:33PM
NickGuy at 2:02AM, April 11, 2009
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BffSatan
Yeah, it's totally ok to make fun of the mentaly disabled, but rape humour is not cool.

Double-freaking-standards.

exactly. so many innappropriate things are made fun of in todays comedies (unplanned parenthood, illegal drug use, etc) that this doesnt even bother me at all. seth rogen movies are stupid anyways, I hate his fucking stoner laugh, but this is hardly a taboo topic.

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“Kung Fu Komix is..told with all the stupid exuberance of the genre it parodies” -The Real Macabre
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:15PM
Skullbie at 2:07AM, April 11, 2009
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I think if you woke up with a sore hamhole and realized seth rogan was responsible you'd be singing a very different tune.~my mind is telling me no….but my body 's tellin me ye-ees~
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:47PM
NickGuy at 2:19AM, April 11, 2009
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eh i seem to be in the extreme minority with this opinion but i really dont find seth rogen funny at all. and judd apatow has worn himself very thin.

“Kung Fu Komix IS…hardcore martial art action all the way. 8/10” -Harkovast
“Kung Fu Komix is that rare comic that is made with heart and love of the medium, and it delivers” -Zenstrive
“Kung Fu Komix is…so awesome” -threeeyeswurm
“Kung Fu Komix is..told with all the stupid exuberance of the genre it parodies” -The Real Macabre
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:15PM
Exzachly at 6:13AM, April 11, 2009
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Someone
many, many victims of rape will see it, and the PTSD that often accompanies rape will mean that, for a joke, for some dipshit filmmaker’s attempt at being edgy, they are going to experience all of the pain and psychological trauma associated with that experience, they are going to feel that rape all over again, there, in their seats, in the theater, and they are going to pay for the experience, and if they try to talk about what that filmmaker did to them it’s probably going to get sidetracked into some conversation about the Sanctity of Art which is invariably given more consideration than their actual lives.

Using the line of reason above, is there any reason not to condemn Schindler's List, Saving Private Ryan, and Platoon? War veterans and holocaust survivors are still around, and no doubt they'd relive some traumatic moments if they were to see any of those movies. Hey, what about all those 911 documentaries? The Deer Hunter? What other movies have some suffering in it that could potentially be relived by some victim in the audience?

Now, I haven't seen the movie so I can't say whether it's edgy or retarded (and, I should point out, neither have any of the ladies we're talking about here), but through a quick metacritic run I learned that the movie isn't meant to be fun. It's meant to be more of a half disturbing-half dark comedy hybrid thing; that the protagonist is pathological and isn't meant to be likable. And in that context, in which a date rape scene would be portrayed as creepy and not fun or endorsed, I don't see the problem. I dunno, I would have to see the movie before making any kind of judgment on it. I just wanted to point out that the reasoning doesn't really hold water.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:25PM
Hyena H_ll at 7:59AM, April 11, 2009
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Exzachly
Using the line of reason above, is there any reason not to condemn Schindler's List, Saving Private Ryan, and Platoon? War veterans and holocaust survivors are still around, and no doubt they'd relive some traumatic moments if they were to see any of those movies. Hey, what about all those 911 documentaries? The Deer Hunter? What other movies have some suffering in it that could potentially be relived by some victim in the audience?

Here's the difference: were those movies comedies? Plus, if I recall pretty much all of those made it very clear that they contained graphic and/or disturbing images and content.

Honestly- I'm of the “make whatever ya want, it's a free country” opinion. Even if it makes me want to puke, or rip your face off, or gets you excommunicated- whatever. It's your right. What I don't like is not being warned beforehand. If I know a movie's got that kind of stuff in it, I can make a choice to see it or not.

I dunno, I don't pay attention to pretty much anything at all having to do with popular media- Is this content something that's being advertised? I mean, if I were a normal movie-goer, is there a chance that I could walk into the theatre not knowing that scene was going to be in there?

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:52PM
ozoneocean at 8:55AM, April 11, 2009
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Is it date rape at all? As far as I can tell from this whole thing is that someone saw a 3 second clip in a film teaser and started a big rant from what they assumed they saw.

This reminds me of the huge thing about the game “bully” just because of the title. Can't we at least wait to see if that's what's actually happening in this movie before we start the book burnings?
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:33PM
HippieVan at 6:26PM, April 11, 2009
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I watched the trailer and I didn't see anybody raping anybody…did I watch the wrong trailer or something?
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:49PM
lothar at 12:51AM, April 12, 2009
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who the fuck is seth rogane ???
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
Exzachly at 5:31AM, April 12, 2009
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Hyena H_ll
Here's the difference: were those movies comedies?
The victim in the audience would still be suffering, comedy or no. And if we say consideration for potential victims in the audience should trump the sanctity of art, then we really have no choice but to condemn those movies too.

Is this content something that's being advertised? I mean, if I were a normal movie-goer, is there a chance that I could walk into the theatre not knowing that scene was going to be in there?
Well, the people condemning the movie said they saw the scene in a trailer. I haven't seen that trailer, but the stuff I see on TV definitely gives off the impression that it's gonna be a bit darker than what you'd expect of a Rogan movie (at least to me).
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:25PM
Skullbie at 6:19AM, April 12, 2009
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But they wouldn't be pissed off the film was basically making light of their situation and even making fun of it with a comedy, there's a huge difference between saving private ryan's emotionally moving seriousness and a ‘comedy’ about a bipolar date raping mallcop that makes light of it.

So no, we do not have to condemn movies like saving private ryan because we choose to believe observe and reports representation of a serious subject was tasteless.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:47PM
Hyena H_ll at 7:00AM, April 12, 2009
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Exzachly
Hyena H_ll
Here's the difference: were those movies comedies?
The victim in the audience would still be suffering, comedy or no. And if we say consideration for potential victims in the audience should trump the sanctity of art, then we really have no choice but to condemn those movies too.
I'm not saying this movie ought to be “condemned”, or that movies (of whatever genre) shouldn't have content that could potentially offend, disturb, etc.

I'm just saying that the reason people are getting mad at this one is because it's a tasteless comedy, and not some award-winning docudrama about war, or whatever. There's been plenty of films with graphic rape scenes in them. But because this one is meant to be funny, it kind of changes the context. You gotta remember that about 1 in 6 women in the US has been raped/ sexually assaulted; most of them take it quite seriously, I assure you.

Exzachly
Well, the people condemning the movie said they saw the scene in a trailer. I haven't seen that trailer, but the stuff I see on TV definitely gives off the impression that it's gonna be a bit darker than what you'd expect of a Rogan movie (at least to me).
I don't know- the TV trailer did have a couple lines in it that were kind of joking about rape, but it didn't give me the impression that I'd be watching one. The reason this is significant to me is that, in my experience with PTSD is that it's not necessarily seeing a certain thing that triggers a reaction, but being surprised by that thing- having it appear out of the context in which you'd expect it (and thus be able to prepare for it). That's my deal; just gimme a heads-up.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:52PM
Jonko at 7:54AM, April 12, 2009
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Hippie Van
I watched the trailer and I didn't see anybody raping anybody…did I watch the wrong trailer or something?

To be honest this is the part that really disturbs me. I just saw it too and if I didn't read this post before I wouldn't have known there was anything about rape.

For any of the 9/11 movies or war movies, at least they would know what they were watching and make an educated decision about whether or not they want to relive the trauma of that event.

For this movie I feel there is the danger of being a rape victim, innocently going to see this movie, and being extremely offended as a result. If movie makers are going to use something as offensive as date rape for their subject matter, I think there should be at least a little more warning about that… All this trailer focuses on is the humor, which to me is something that is extremely dangerous.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:10PM
BffSatan at 8:28AM, April 12, 2009
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Skullbie
But they wouldn't be pissed off the film was basically making light of their situation and even making fun of it with a comedy, there's a huge difference between saving private ryan's emotionally moving seriousness and a ‘comedy’ about a bipolar date raping mallcop that makes light of it.

So no, we do not have to condemn movies like saving private ryan because we choose to believe observe and reports representation of a serious subject was tasteless.
You seems to have missed my point in my earlier remark. Let me spell it out for you, in capital letters so you can understand.
YOU HAVE TITLED THIS THREAD WITH THE WORD RETARDED, THAT IS HIGHLY OFFENSIVE, RETARDATION IS A SERIOUS CONDITION AND ANYONE WHO KNOWS A MENTALY CHALLENGED PERSON WOULD BE OFFENDED BY YOUR USE OF THE WORD. THE EXACT SAME LOGIC YOU JUST SPOKE OF CAN BE APPLIED TO THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:20AM
Hyena H_ll at 8:50AM, April 12, 2009
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Jonko
For any of the 9/11 movies or war movies, at least they would know what they were watching and make an educated decision about whether or not they want to relive the trauma of that event.

For this movie I feel there is the danger of being a rape victim, innocently going to see this movie, and being extremely offended as a result.

That's what I'm sayin'. It's the not knowing it's coming and thus not being able to make that informed decision that bothers me- not the actual content. Had I (or a lot of women I know) gone to this film, been trapped in a dark theatre and been forced to watch that scene while other moviegoers laughed… well, that's more than “offended”. It's humiliating and painful. I'm not particularly sensitive, but it would've been excruciatingly uncomfortable for me, to the point that I might have had to leave. I know a lot of other women that it would have been out-and-out traumatic for.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:52PM
Sea_Cow at 8:58AM, April 12, 2009
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Guys. Did anyone see the previews for this movie? Everybody who watches it will get offended, rape or not.
I am so happy to finally be back home
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:26PM
Hawk at 10:50AM, April 12, 2009
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Sea_Cow's probably right. The movie looks stupid no matter your standpoint on the comedic value of date rape. But I think the woman who wrote the article needs to either see the film or talk with a few reliable people who have seen the film before before making a big stand. Trailers are just a grab-bag of clips without context, and sometimes parts of trailers aren't even in the movie.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
Sea_Cow at 11:05AM, April 12, 2009
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Also, I doubt this movie will be viewed by victims of rape. They would have a serious outlook on life, which is a big no-no if you watch any movie like this. They'll just watch it as a social metaphor, not a movie designed for entertainment, go on a big BAAAWWW-fest about how they got their feelings hurt by some toilet humor, and the adolescents will get their funnies. End of story.
I am so happy to finally be back home
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:26PM
Hyena H_ll at 11:59AM, April 12, 2009
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Sea_Cow
Also, I doubt this movie will be viewed by victims of rape. They would have a serious outlook on life…
They would? Really? because I don't have a “serious outlook on life”. I didn't know being raped negated your sense of humor. From henceforth, I shall endeavor to be more serious, stop making jokes, and focus entirely upon the bad things that have happened to me.

Sorry if that came off at dickish. I was trying to be funny- aw, crap! There I go again!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:52PM
Skullbie at 2:57PM, April 12, 2009
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BffSatan
AND ANYONE WHO KNOWS A MENTALY CHALLENGED PERSON WOULD BE OFFENDED BY YOUR USE OF THE WORD.
I apologize to the normal people who know some disabled people that have to take a commonplace slang and make it politically correct as a way of apologizing for themselves.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:47PM
lastcall at 5:44PM, April 12, 2009
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women and hollywood
So I forced myself to watch the trailer and there for all the world to see is Seth Rogen raping the passed out Anna Faris.

OK I just sat through the whole trailer and I didn't see anything date rape-y like. And it looks like a terrible movie. Not funny at all, for a comedy movie.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:28PM
lba at 6:09PM, April 12, 2009
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Skullbie
I think if you woke up with a sore hamhole and realized seth rogan was responsible you'd be singing a very different tune.~my mind is telling me no….but my body 's tellin me ye-ees~
No. I'd still think Seth Rogan ought to be outlawed for just being a crap actor and comedian.



Like I said before, I've seen movies that make fun of this stuff before with both sexes having been the victim, so I'm not exactly sure why it comes up now. I've seen the trailers and didn't pick up on any rape overtones, other than the bar-scene standard of being too drunk to make intelligent choices and I'm usually pretty good about noticing such things. I'm coming to the conclusion, from what I see, that this is someone who has latched on to something that might or might not actually be visible. I mean, don't call me insensitive, because I'd be just as pissed as anyone else if they showed a scene where she's tied down and clearly being raped and they play a laugh track. I just think there needs to be a bit more than the couple seconds of video there to call it and I don't quite understand what the difference is here compared to other movies that deal with rape. I never heard feminists or anyone else complain about Marcellus Wallace getting it from Billy Boy in Pulp Fiction.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:29PM
Jonko at 7:28PM, April 12, 2009
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Maybe the main problem in this movie is that they're mocking a situation where someone is a “victim” of something. Rape or not, PTS is something that's very sensitive and probably isn't something that should be touched by a comedy.

Correct me if I'm wrong, since I haven't really seen many comedies in my adolescence, but are there any comedies out there that completely mock someone for being the victim of a crime, and then freaking out about it? If there are I'd like to know what people felt about those movies…
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:10PM
Kristen Gudsnuk at 8:44PM, April 12, 2009
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Actually, I think it's odd that you guys are writing off comedy (even idiotic, brainless comedy) as unable to make a social statement. I'm actually taking a class called “Comedy and Tragedy” right now, and one of the interesting things about the comedic works we've read is how they've managed to sneak in social commentary into seemingly innocuous, brainless stories about stupid people. (I'm thinking of Lope de Vega's “La dama boba”, which is about a very stupid woman who falls in love with a man who is using her for her money, but the play manages to sneak in a critique of the upper class, and of women's hardships in a patriarchy.) Think about it– those 70s comedians like Lenny Bruce were able to talk about touchy subjects partially because comedy softens a message that might be too sensitive at the moment.

I think that if movies like “Sweeney Todd” and “Batman: The Dark Knight” can make serial killing hilarious, well then, go ahead, “Observe & Report”. As long as it's funny (unfortunately, it looks like a terrible movie; that's probably why people are protesting!) it's fine by me.

You can't blame date-rape on scenes like this– rape has been around as long as sex has, and it's not the kind of statistic that'll be influenced by a Seth Rogan movie. There's rape in Tess of the D'Urbervilles, and death-by-rape in the Old Testament.

People with Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder can't just avoid the subject forever. Rape will come up, either in conversation, or in Law & Order: SVU. Therapy, not complete avoidance of the subject, is the best bet for such people.

and RE:
Article
they are going to feel that rape all over again, there, in their seats, in the theater, and they are going to pay for the experience, and if they try to talk about what that filmmaker did to them it’s probably going to get sidetracked into some conversation about the Sanctity of Art which is invariably given more consideration than their actual lives.
Well, if we didn't write that book or make that movie because we were taking people's traumatic experiences into account, there wouldn't be too much art in the world. We'd be stuck with ‘Space Chimps’– or maybe not even that, because the idea of sending animals into space makes me think of those monkeys who died being sent up into outer space…
This reeks of censorship, and anyone who puts the feelings of a minority of moviegoers over the Sanctity of Art is… just… a weak person.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:22PM

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