Debate and Discussion

Human-Animal Hybrids.
kyupol at 3:23PM, July 17, 2008
(offline)
posts: 3,713
joined: 1-12-2006
I really couldnt believe my ears when I heard a radio program talk about human-animal hybrids.

But its true. National Geographic (a mainstream publication) admits it.

What are the implications of this? If you put a mouse with a human brain, is that mouse gonna be a sentient being? If it is a sentient being, does it make it subject to “human rights”? Is that thing capable of human emotions? Is it capable of love? of fear? of guilt? of feeling humiliated? of sympathy?

So if these things do exist, I wonder. If it is still considered insane that things like vampires and werewolves and bigfoot do exist. If they do exist, they probably are hybrids that were created by advanced human civilizations in the past.
NOW UPDATING!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:26PM
Hawk at 3:31PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 2,760
joined: 1-2-2006
At first I thought, “What kind of screwball link is he sending us to?”. But folks, I assure you, it's a link to legitimate news on real genetic research being conducted.

As far as my opinion goes, I don't like it. I don't mind a pig with a human's blood flowing through it, but putting a human's brain into something else just doesn't seem very humane to me.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
subcultured at 3:42PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 5,392
joined: 1-7-2006
didn't they have this in batman beyond?
splicers!

i think it would be cool…lets do it!
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
Bittenbymonk at 3:54PM, July 17, 2008
(offline)
posts: 422
joined: 1-6-2008
well the wayn i see it, a brain doesnt make something human, bbeing human makes something human. humanity can be identified by our dna, whether we belong to the genus homo sapien, not what parts we have. although, this calls into question whether altering our own dna with animal dna would leave us not human… id consider something born human to be human, so something born a hybrid wont be human and wouldn't deserve rights under our system; but surely it would have its own rights like animal rights.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:22AM
mapaghimagsik at 4:40PM, July 17, 2008
(offline)
posts: 711
joined: 9-8-2006
I, for one, welcome my human-animal hybrid overlord.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:51PM
lothar at 6:32PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,299
joined: 1-3-2006
so if they can inject human neurons into the brain of a mouse , why not a whale ? or an elephant or some giant coral … turn the whole planet into one huge brain !!
i like the part about the human that has mice for parents , it's like stuart little gone backwards !
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
subcultured at 7:09PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 5,392
joined: 1-7-2006
the world will turn into a disney movie. maybe they can inject neurons into lamps and toasters.
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
Aussie_kid at 7:56PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 591
joined: 1-1-2006
I think it's a part of evolution. Not for the animals, of course, but for humans. You see, every day we are moving towards eliminating discrimination of our fellow people. We're not there yet, but we'll get there one of these days.

Unfortunately, it is a part of humanity to have a group that we see as inferior. There are white people who see blacks as inferior to them and vice versa. Therefore, in order to completely exterminate this thinking towards our fellow humans, we need someone to take the place as the inferior. And who else has been caged, tortured and enslaved ever since society started to take form? That's right, the animals. We can't understand their feelings, so generally no one cares about them.

Dolly the sheep was the first being successfully cloned, and yet she quickly aged and died. How many of us remember her? No one, so scientists are free to further experiment on animals. A pig was made to survive with human blood, but how many died or suffered before this result? Is the pig in constant pain now? We'll never know, because it's a pig and it can't talk, but also because no one will really care.

I think that's also why human experimentation is illegal. The advancement would be made clear and if we saw a baby that had been cloned crying all the time and screeching out in pain because it the scientists had gotten something wrong, we would want those doctors drawn and quartered. And then when that happens, science stops.

Now to those of you who are currently forming an opinion on me, let it be known I eat meat, love it, and will always. I don't protest and I'm not exactly an animal rights activist. This is just me when I think.
Insanity Complex: We may not be insane, but we like to think we are
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:11AM
DAJB at 11:45PM, July 17, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,462
joined: 2-23-2007
This reminds me of the Restaurant at the End of the Universe and its sentient, talking cow which had been engineered specifically to want to be eaten. The scene in which it recommended the best cuts to the diners was quite gross in its own way but - as it quite coherently argued - it must be more ethical to eat an animal that actually wants to be eaten than to eat one that doesn't. See - there are real advantages to animals with human brains!

In fact some of them would probably be much better company than certain humans who seem to have the brains of some less developed species of animal!

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
parkbenchbook at 1:13AM, July 18, 2008
(offline)
posts: 229
joined: 10-28-2007
A cat that cooks breakfast or a dog that drives a van and has an awesome collection of bootleg tapes?
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:38PM
Aurora Moon at 8:08AM, July 18, 2008
(offline)
posts: 2,630
joined: 1-7-2006
horrified leg jerk reaction aside, I do believe this could be a excellent way to help advance our health in so many ways.

For example…. if animals can actually grow human parts, like that mouse with the ear, then so many people who lost limbs could end up having surgeries to replace those lost limbs.

Before, that was pretty much impossible and even in the realm of science fiction. I think it's pretty much wonderful that we'll be able to do something like that sooner or later.

The same thing with being able to use blood transfusions, etc.

Although I'm pretty much soft-hearted when it comes to animals, so I do have the concern of treating those animals humanely.

After all, they are helping us advance our science… so the least we can do is make sure that they don't suffer needlessly and that they live an moderately comfortable life as an lab rat.
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
ozoneocean at 11:15PM, July 18, 2008
(online)
posts: 25,114
joined: 1-2-2004
There are a hell of a lot of ethical issues here. It's quite sad and disturbing that people don't seem to think along those lines when considering these topics.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:31PM
DARKNES at 7:36AM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 80
joined: 7-22-2007
Hawk
At first I thought, “What kind of screwball link is he sending us to?”. But folks, I assure you, it's a link to legitimate news on real genetic research being conducted.

As far as my opinion goes, I don't like it. I don't mind a pig with a human's blood flowing through it, but putting a human's brain into something else just doesn't seem very humane to me.

Look u talk about the poor humans but does anyone talk about the poor fukin animals, as a veggie i believe that animals have the same wrights as humans, how can people sleep at night when these poor animals are being tested on!!!!!!!!!!!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:07PM
ozoneocean at 8:09AM, July 21, 2008
(online)
posts: 25,114
joined: 1-2-2004
DARKNES
Look u talk about the poor humans but does anyone talk about the poor fukin animals, as a veggie i believe that animals have the same wrights as humans, how can people sleep at night when these poor animals are being tested on!!!!!!!!!!!!!
However, I notice that your avatar is a type of Pokemon that changes into various different states as a result of its “owners” experimenting on it with various “evolution” stones. :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:31PM
lothar at 8:57AM, July 21, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,299
joined: 1-3-2006
ozoneocean
DARKNES
Look u talk about the poor humans but does anyone talk about the poor fukin animals, as a veggie i believe that animals have the same wrights as humans, how can people sleep at night when these poor animals are being tested on!!!!!!!!!!!!!
However, I notice that your avatar is a type of Pokemon that changes into various different states as a result of its “owners” experimenting on it with various “evolution” stones. :)


LOL

it almost seems like pokemon is some sort of indoctrinating propaganda to get us all ready for the crazy future of bioengineered super freaks !!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
DARKNES at 8:58AM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 80
joined: 7-22-2007
ozoneocean
DARKNES
Look u talk about the poor humans but does anyone talk about the poor fukin animals, as a veggie i believe that animals have the same wrights as humans, how can people sleep at night when these poor animals are being tested on!!!!!!!!!!!!!
However, I notice that your avatar is a type of Pokemon that changes into various different states as a result of its “owners” experimenting on it with various “evolution” stones. :)


And you have to remember that a game is very different to realife, I must say people these days have no respect fof the animals which saddens me to the very core, you have to remember that animals were here before humans!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:07PM
ozoneocean at 9:16AM, July 21, 2008
(online)
posts: 25,114
joined: 1-2-2004
DARKNES
And you have to remember that a game is very different to realife, I must say people these days have no respect fof the animals which saddens me to the very core, you have to remember that animals were here before humans!
Wrong. Humans are animals. ;)

And; that's a concept in a game and animated fiction, a concept that you choose display there. Just as it is a concept that we're discussing. And that is interesting to me :)

—————
I DO agree that the idea is ethically questionable though. In science it's NOT a case of "we can do it so we WILL.“ That's an attitude of mad scientists in cartoons. In reality there are ethics boards, and when those are ineffective there's the fact that this science happens within complex functioning cultures with a lot of overlapping ideas, ”morals", traditions, laws, and ideas about how things are supposed to be. Science DOES NOT occur in some sort of “progress at all costs and damn what people say” vacuum, the way it seems that people here think it does. -_-

-I say “seems”, because I'm not saying people here do think that way; it just appears like that to me.
lothar
it almost seems like pokemon is some sort of indoctrinating propaganda to get us all ready for the crazy future of bioengineered super freaks !!!
It does have a touch of that :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:31PM
DARKNES at 9:52AM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 80
joined: 7-22-2007
ozoneocean
DARKNES
And you have to remember that a game is very different to realife, I must say people these days have no respect fof the animals which saddens me to the very core, you have to remember that animals were here before humans!
Wrong. Humans are animals. ;)

And; that's a concept in a game and animated fiction, a concept that you choose display there. Just as it is a concept that we're discussing. And that is interesting to me :)

—————
I DO agree that the idea is ethically questionable though. In science it's NOT a case of "we can do it so we WILL.“ That's an attitude of mad scientists in cartoons. In reality there are ethics boards, and when those are ineffective there's the fact that this science happens within complex functioning cultures with a lot of overlapping ideas, ”morals", traditions, laws, and ideas about how things are supposed to be. Science DOES NOT occur in some sort of “progress at all costs and damn what people say” vacuum, the way it seems that people here think it does. -_-

-I say “seems”, because I'm not saying people here do think that way; it just appears like that to me.
lothar
it almost seems like pokemon is some sort of indoctrinating propaganda to get us all ready for the crazy future of bioengineered super freaks !!!
It does have a touch of that :)

If you say we are animals then why do we treat our brothers and sisters of the earth like this
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:07PM
lothar at 10:07AM, July 21, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,299
joined: 1-3-2006
DARKNES
If you say we are animals then why do we treat our brothers and sisters of the earth like this

uhhh … just look how we treat other humans
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
DARKNES at 10:57AM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 80
joined: 7-22-2007
lothar
DARKNES
If you say we are animals then why do we treat our brothers and sisters of the earth like this

uhhh … just look how we treat other humans



Yes but animals cant stick up for themselfs
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:07PM
kyupol at 1:56PM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 3,713
joined: 1-12-2006
ozoneocean
There are a hell of a lot of ethical issues here. It's quite sad and disturbing that people don't seem to think along those lines when considering these topics.

Because society has been so manipulated and dumbed down that there is no more value placed on human life.

Took me awhile to get that through my skull. But that IS the truth. I'm sorry.
NOW UPDATING!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:26PM
StaceyMontgomery at 3:41PM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 520
joined: 4-7-2007
No more value on human life? I think that's a silly thing to say. Throughout history human life has been held very, very cheap. Only in recent times has that changed.

Even the research that spawned this thread is primarily medical - yet another attempt to fight disease and improve human health and lifespans. Now, Any new technology raises ethical questions, and we must consider those. But this is the golden age of Human life, there has never been anything like it.

Human life has never, never been held as sacred as it is now.

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:55PM
imshard at 3:49PM, July 21, 2008
(offline)
posts: 2,961
joined: 7-26-2007


Yes that is a human ear growing out of a mouse. From a medical science view I think its terrific. Hybridized animals as organ farms. It means we can grow organs for dying patients, and give limbs back to amputees. We could even use their own DNA so it would actually be “their” own body parts.

From an ethical view I think it is a monstrous perversion of life. We have to think about where this leaves us as human beings. There are boundaries in science that we should not cross and sacrifices that should not be made.

Don't be a stick in the mud traditionalist! Support global warming!

Tech Support: The Comic!! Updates Somedays!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:58PM
ozoneocean at 9:14PM, July 21, 2008
(online)
posts: 25,114
joined: 1-2-2004
imshard
Yes that is a human ear growing out of a mouse.
Actually it's not.

That's just a framework (not human) in "shape" like a human ear. It was an experiment to see if by putting that inside the mouse's skin there, whether it would build on it and populate it with living tissue. It's more like a living sculpture than the hybrid.

But it is a sort of a shocking image. And your summation of what we can do is pretty valid :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:31PM
Aussie_kid at 2:29AM, July 22, 2008
(online)
posts: 591
joined: 1-1-2006
DARKNES
lothar
DARKNES
If you say we are animals then why do we treat our brothers and sisters of the earth like this
uhhh … just look how we treat other humans
Yes but animals cant stick up for themselfs
I guess this comes back to what I was saying before.

Animals can stick up for themselves, just see what happens when a stranger walks into a dog's territory. But we as humans do not always recognise their unwillingness and so dismiss it because we cannot understand what is trying to be said. Look at Charlton Heston's character in Planet of the Apes (The original). The other woman he was with could not say a word, but he dragged her around to where he wanted to go. Did she want to go with him, or did she feel she had no choice, since he could speak like her ape masters, and simply submitted?
Insanity Complex: We may not be insane, but we like to think we are
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:11AM
DARKNES at 3:36AM, July 22, 2008
(offline)
posts: 80
joined: 7-22-2007
imshard


Yes that is a human ear growing out of a mouse. From a medical science view I think its terrific. Hybridized animals as organ farms. It means we can grow organs for dying patients, and give limbs back to amputees. We could even use their own DNA so it would actually be “their” own body parts.

From an ethical view I think it is a monstrous perversion of life. We have to think about where this leaves us as human beings. There are boundaries in science that we should not cross and sacrifices that should not be made.




Why are we greater than the animals just cause we are smarter!!!!!!!!!!!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:07PM
Aurora Moon at 11:51AM, July 22, 2008
(offline)
posts: 2,630
joined: 1-7-2006
Aussie_kid
DARKNES
lothar
DARKNES
If you say we are animals then why do we treat our brothers and sisters of the earth like this
uhhh … just look how we treat other humans
Yes but animals cant stick up for themselfs
I guess this comes back to what I was saying before.

Animals can stick up for themselves, just see what happens when a stranger walks into a dog's territory. But we as humans do not always recognize their unwillingness and so dismiss it because we cannot understand what is trying to be said. Look at Charlton Heston's character in Planet of the Apes (The original). The other woman he was with could not say a word, but he dragged her around to where he wanted to go. Did she want to go with him, or did she feel she had no choice, since he could speak like her ape masters, and simply submitted?

I believe that the other animals of the world (being that humans ARE animals too), are more smarter than we give them credit for.

Just look at a certain breed of crow who can actually fashion and create their own tools out of twigs to collect food that they couldn't normally get at before. And they also have an ability to adapt to using other things besides twigs too.

Then there's the apes, monkeys and so on forth who can also use tools out of rocks, etc….

There's so many animals who can adapt much as humans can, and clearly they have their own methods of communication that humans cannot depicer. Yet most humans assume that just because they cannot depicer those sounds that animals make when they warn each other of danger, or to tell each other of other things, that those sounds are nothing but animal gibberish.

Really, in the end the only thing we have as an advantage over animals is the fact that we have opposable thumbs, and have an slightly higher intelligence.

however I have to say that one thing that sets us apart is EMPATHY. A wild cougar who came across an wounded smaller animal such as an lamb wouldn't feel the need to take care of it… instead she'd want to kill it and maybe eat it. Even if she wasn't hungry, she'd still drag it back to her home to eat later.

So if we have any pride in being human, then we need to exercise this empathy and make sure that we don't make any of the animals OR other humans suffer when we use the animals for science. Give them an comfortable, happy life to our best ability when we test on them. That's the least we can do.
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
bobhhh at 11:58AM, July 23, 2008
(offline)
posts: 893
joined: 5-12-2007
kyupol
I really couldnt believe my ears when I heard a radio program talk about human-animal hybrids.

But its true. National Geographic (a mainstream publication) admits it.

What are the implications of this? If you put a mouse with a human brain, is that mouse gonna be a sentient being? If it is a sentient being, does it make it subject to “human rights”? Is that thing capable of human emotions? Is it capable of love? of fear? of guilt? of feeling humiliated? of sympathy?

So if these things do exist, I wonder. If it is still considered insane that things like vampires and werewolves and bigfoot do exist. If they do exist, they probably are hybrids that were created by advanced human civilizations in the past.

The furries might like it! :P
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:30AM
bobhhh at 12:11PM, July 23, 2008
(offline)
posts: 893
joined: 5-12-2007
StaceyMontgomery
No more value on human life? I think that's a silly thing to say. Throughout history human life has been held very, very cheap. Only in recent times has that changed.

Even the research that spawned this thread is primarily medical - yet another attempt to fight disease and improve human health and lifespans. Now, Any new technology raises ethical questions, and we must consider those. But this is the golden age of Human life, there has never been anything like it.

Human life has never, never been held as sacred as it is now.



Yeah people crack me up when they talk about the culture of death and how human life has less value these days.

People in this country used to walk around with guns on their hips ready to shoot you dead for looking at them funny.

More recntly trees used to have people (mostly black people) hanging from them becuase some one decided, without the benefit of the criminal justice system, that they ought to be dead.

It seems to me that we care more for life these days when you consider things like the moratorium on executions that came from the revelation that we might execute innocent people. In the “good old days” people just shrugged at best and said things like you gotta break some eggs to make an omelet or at worst little homilies like kill ‘em all and let god sort ’em out.

People who think life used to be more simple and more respected have either watched too much 50's TV or listened to too many curmudgeonly conservatives.

My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:30AM

Forgot Password
©2011 WOWIO, Inc. All Rights Reserved