Debate and Discussion

Iran - Should we Invade?
bobhhh at 4:19PM, Jan. 2, 2008
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I agree that it looks bad when we talk about the irresponsibility of other nations with their nukes when in the entire nuclear community, we are the only ones who ever dropped one on an enemy.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
albone at 8:33AM, Jan. 3, 2008
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You make a great point about responsibility. If anything though, it goes to show why a nuclear bomb should never be used again.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 10:48AM
mapaghimagsik at 12:09PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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We make the same argument about torture. When they do it, its torture, and inhuman. When we do it, we're Jack Bauer using “advanced interrogation techniques.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:51PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 2:09PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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mapaghimagsik
When we do it, we're Jack Bauer using “advanced interrogation techniques.”

Gotta love them cop shows. Got a buddy who calls them “count the constitutional violations” shows. He has a whole drinking game set up for watching them. Usually we are passed out before the second commercial break…
My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM
mapaghimagsik at 2:39PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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Not to mention that every vehicle becomes bulletproof in those shows…
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:51PM
imshard at 3:33PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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bobhhh
I agree that it looks bad when we talk about the irresponsibility of other nations with their nukes when in the entire nuclear community, we are the only ones who ever dropped one on an enemy.

Who better to tell others not to commit a crime than the criminal who has lived to regret the same act.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:58PM
CharleyHorse at 7:33PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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I don't think most U.S. citizens have ever evinced regret for the atomic bomb drops on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. There are standard arguments for and against having dropped them, of course; and they almost always originate from one's ideological loyalties once you scrap away the intellectual aspects of the arguments, justifications, and even the occasional rare regret.

Personally I stand by the assertion that we would not have dropped atomic bombs were the fortunes of war to have run differently and Japan gone down in defeat before Germany. Drop atomic bombs on putative white people - on real and actual actual human beings? Perish the thought! On the other hand, drop atomic bombs on clever yellow monkeys? Damn straight! Teach the near-sighted, buck-toothed bastards a lesson about sneak attacking real people by God!

Of course the racial theory of the atomic bomb drops is not a particularly popular one, but I like it.

I suspect there is a bit of ‘smelly camel jockeys’ thinking among the people wanting to justify the preemptive strike against Iraq and the theoretical one in regards to Iran. Would we have been so quick to attack Iraq had it been English speaking Caucasians embracing a comforting mix of British and U.S. culture? Would we for a second allow Bush and his fellow animals posture in regards to attacking Iran for no good reason were the nation a wonderful mix of people just like us? I really don't think so.



last edited on July 14, 2011 11:40AM
bobhhh at 7:58PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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CharleyHorse
I don't think most U.S. citizens have ever evinced regret for the atomic bomb drops on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. There are standard arguments for and against having dropped them, of course; and they almost always originate from one's ideological loyalties once you scrap away the intellectual aspects of the arguments, justifications, and even the occasional rare regret.

Personally I stand by the assertion that we would not have dropped atomic bombs were the fortunes of war to have run differently and Japan gone down in defeat before Germany. Drop atomic bombs on putative white people - on real and actual actual human beings? Perish the thought! On the other hand, drop atomic bombs on clever yellow monkeys? Damn straight! Teach the near-sighted, buck-toothed bastards a lesson about sneak attacking real people by God!

Of course the racial theory of the atomic bomb drops is not a particularly popular one, but I like it.

I suspect there is a bit of ‘smelly camel jockeys’ thinking among the people wanting to justify the preemptive strike against Iraq and the theoretical one in regards to Iran. Would we have been so quick to attack Iraq had it been English speaking Caucasians embracing a comforting mix of British and U.S. culture? Would we for a second allow Bush and his fellow animals posture in regards to attacking Iran for no good reason were the nation a wonderful mix of people just like us? I really don't think so.

I'll be the first to say there is a lot of racism in political decisions past and present, biut i don't think that explains hiroshima.

More likely they wanted simultaneously to end the war with japan by fear oof the new weapon and scare the bejesus out of the russians. It was a moment of bad ass posturing and it wouldn't have mattered one wet slap of it was blonde haired aryans or yellow skinned japanese. Let's not forget the fire bombing in dresden, that was also a devastating mass murder and there where plenty of white people there.
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
imshard at 8:18PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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bobhhh
CharleyHorse
I don't think most U.S. citizens have ever evinced regret for the atomic bomb drops on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. There are standard arguments for and against having dropped them, of course; and they almost always originate from one's ideological loyalties once you scrap away the intellectual aspects of the arguments, justifications, and even the occasional rare regret.

Personally I stand by the assertion that we would not have dropped atomic bombs were the fortunes of war to have run differently and Japan gone down in defeat before Germany. Drop atomic bombs on putative white people - on real and actual actual human beings? Perish the thought! On the other hand, drop atomic bombs on clever yellow monkeys? Damn straight! Teach the near-sighted, buck-toothed bastards a lesson about sneak attacking real people by God!

Of course the racial theory of the atomic bomb drops is not a particularly popular one, but I like it.

I suspect there is a bit of ‘smelly camel jockeys’ thinking among the people wanting to justify the preemptive strike against Iraq and the theoretical one in regards to Iran. Would we have been so quick to attack Iraq had it been English speaking Caucasians embracing a comforting mix of British and U.S. culture? Would we for a second allow Bush and his fellow animals posture in regards to attacking Iran for no good reason were the nation a wonderful mix of people just like us? I really don't think so.

I'll be the first to say there is a lot of racism in political decisions past and present, biut i don't think that explains hiroshima.

More likely they wanted simultaneously to end the war with japan by fear oof the new weapon and scare the bejesus out of the russians. It was a moment of bad ass posturing and it wouldn't have mattered one wet slap of it was blonde haired aryans or yellow skinned japanese. Let's not forget the fire bombing in dresden, that was also a devastating mass murder and there where plenty of white people there.

Indeed the axis suffered great civilian losses and faced firebombed cities in Europe and the pacific. Post-war international convention outlawed firebombing and the use of WMDs on civilian areas. There was regret and posturing that the use of nukes to preclude further hostilities was racism is ridiculous. The concern with Iran is that they would not scruple to follow international laws they have not signed when it comes to nukes. Really, would you hand a gun to a man who has said he will kill you and your friends, or do you scrabble to stop him from reaching a weapon?
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:58PM
ozoneocean at 8:36PM, Jan. 3, 2008
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The US HAS nukes though and reserves the right to first strike on anyone. Not even the Soviet union had a first strike policy. You analogy is faulty. The US is like the crazy gun nut who hordes weapons and threatens to shoot everybody because he's so afraid. And it IS ready to shoot.
imshard
The concern with Iran is that they would not scruple to follow international laws they have not signed when it comes to nukes.
Iran IS a signatory to non-proliferation.

Please don't talk about international law in regards to the US. This is the politics of power here and the US doesn't sign up to many international agreements on things.. Especially war crimes.

Iran wouldn't be somewhere that I would EVER choose to live, but they're less likely to invade and kill the citizens of another country than the US. Hell, they're even less likely than Israel! Fact.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:29PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 9:28AM, Jan. 4, 2008
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mapaghimagsik
Not to mention that every vehicle becomes bulletproof in those shows…

Until it hits anything larger than a tricycle… then it EXPLODES!!!
My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM

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