Debate and Discussion

Is it Bestiality or simply Interspecies?
meemjar at 9:57PM, March 13, 2010
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When a perverse person takes sexual liberties with a dumb animal it is understandably Bestiality.

But is it ‘Bestiality’ if the creature in question is ‘Anthropomorphised’ (I THINK that's the spelling) meaning to say it has been Humanized and therefore able to reason and ‘consent’ like a human being.

I hope tegerio doesn't mind my using ‘Zanders saga’ as an example of Humanised animals engaging in sexual situations.

You see, in Science fiction stories, many times Human characters fall for Sentient non-humans like Vulcans, Klingons, Zentreadi, the catlike Pandorans of ‘Avatar’ etc.

And in Fantasies its Elves that are the target ‘Exotics’.

So maybe its only Bestiality when a human engages in sex acts with unknowing animals and taking advantage of them.
But if it is with a Sentient creature that can knowingly consent to the act regardless whether it is human or not it is simply ‘Interspecies’.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:58PM
isukun at 6:09AM, March 15, 2010
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By definition bestiality excludes species with similar mental and social capacity as humans. It's been used in some cases when referring to furry porn, but that's not really an accurate use of the term. That paticular fetish falls under the broader category of zoophilia and generally is not as looked down upon as actual bestiality.

Bestiality is a term that specifically refers to sexual activity between a human and a “lower animal” deemed incapable of consent.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:05PM
meemjar at 6:39AM, March 15, 2010
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BINGO!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:58PM
ozoneocean at 8:48AM, July 9, 2010
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isukun
Bestiality is a term that specifically refers to sexual activity between a human and a “lower animal” deemed incapable of consent.
Sounds like a drunken night out.

…wait, that didn't come out right D:

——————————————

I dunno about zoophilia being any better than bestiality. As far as I know they're just synonyms with different language roots- meaning the same thing. Popularly both terms describe sexual intercourse with any non-human animal. Humanised cartoon characters don't count since they're not real; the term for that is “furry porn”. Sex with human “alien” or fantasy characters in movies, TV etc isn't anything special since we all know they're just other humans.

- BTW that “lower animal” thing…? Sex with centaurs, fauns, etc, as depicted in ancient Greek art is considered bestiality, and those creatures weren't “lower” than humans.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:36PM
kyupol at 2:48PM, July 9, 2010
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A pastor I know who talks about Satanic ritual says that animal sex is standard fare in a Satanic ritual. Also sometimes, there are rituals that involve summoning incubi and succubi to have ritual sex with them.

These demons allegedly feed on your sexual energy as well as your negative emotions. You know you had sex with a demon if you enjoy the sex to levels beyond any human can give you… but after a few hours you start to feel depressed and drained for no reason. (I've also checked Satanic sources and they talk about the same thing about how demons are really attractive and sexually perform better than any human).

He cites Genesis 6:4 and 2 Corinthians 11:14 as proof that only demons are the ones who desire having sex with humans.


You see, in Science fiction stories, many times Human characters fall for Sentient non-humans like Vulcans, Klingons, Zentreadi, the catlike Pandorans of ‘Avatar’ etc.

And in Fantasies its Elves that are the target ‘Exotics’.

Predictive programming for alien disclosure? Coast to Coast am seems to be calling for this every other show.

Meanwhile, the Christians say that the aliens are really Satan's demons. Because if you believe that aliens are highly evolved beings, that means you believe in Darwin's evolution theory… which is bunk according to them. That and the earth is only 6000 years old.

Aliens are allegedly part of the Satanic conspiracy (which also includes Atheism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Freemasonry, Theosophy, New Age spirituality, Catholic Church, etc.) because of too many movies churned out by Hollywood that are about aliens.
NOW UPDATING!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:27PM
Product Placement at 4:11PM, July 9, 2010
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kyupol
He cites Genesis 6:4 and 2 Corinthians 11:14 as proof that only demons are the ones who desire having sex with humans.
Guess that makes me a demon then. Can't get enough of the female variety.
Those were my two cents.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 2:53PM
gecko200 at 5:07PM, July 9, 2010
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so if I understand this correctly, Mind blowing sex means you've had sex with a demon and if sex is just okay or adequate you've had sex with a normal person or you're married . what Bullshit! this is just thinking that is tied into puritanical, Victorian era hypocrisy.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:33PM
ozoneocean at 6:56AM, July 10, 2010
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kyupol
A pastor I know who talks about Satanic ritual says that animal sex is standard fare in a Satanic ritual. Also sometimes, there are rituals that involve summoning incubi and succubi to have ritual sex with them.
That guy is a nut.

kyupol
These demons allegedly feed on your sexual energy as well as your negative emotions. You know you had sex with a demon if you enjoy the sex to levels beyond any human can give you… but after a few hours you start to feel depressed and drained for no reason. (I've also checked Satanic sources and they talk about the same thing about how demons are really attractive and sexually perform better than any human).
Those so called “demons” just come from the names of things in pre-Christian religions, so to the sorts of holy people who believe (or believed) in that sort of thing they're just as holy and good as Jesus and any saint.

Heh, I know this is getting way off-topic here, but from all I've learned about the world and all I've read it is exactly the people who point out the evils of “demons” who commit atrocities and do all sorts of nasty things because they're the ones who believe in a supernatural form of evil to begin with- So that justifies (to their mind) any horrible or strange things they do to other people to “fight” it, and if they find they like doing that sort of thing then they claim they were possessed by that evil.

-I'm not bashing religion or Christianity here, just the sorts of people who get nutty about “demons” and supernatural evil. The irony is that those people tend to be the closest we have to such things themselves.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:36PM
kyupol at 7:25AM, July 10, 2010
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so if I understand this correctly, Mind blowing sex means you've had sex with a demon and if sex is just okay or adequate you've had sex with a normal person or you're married . what Bullshit! this is just thinking that is tied into puritanical, Victorian era hypocrisy.

No.

Demons have sex with you when you are asleep and/or when you are half asleep. They can be summoned during a Satanic ritual or when you invite them in. For some reason, demons (aliens? negative entities?) are more eager to come to you. Because they are after weak-minded people who want instant gratification.

Meanwhile, the good entities (angels? aliens? I do not know) would only come to you if you have proven yourself.

Jul 10,`10 8:56am | Quote | Delete
“kyupol” Said:
A pastor I know who talks about Satanic ritual says that animal sex is standard fare in a Satanic ritual. Also sometimes, there are rituals that involve summoning incubi and succubi to have ritual sex with them.
That guy is a nut.

“kyupol” Said:
These demons allegedly feed on your sexual energy as well as your negative emotions. You know you had sex with a demon if you enjoy the sex to levels beyond any human can give you… but after a few hours you start to feel depressed and drained for no reason. (I've also checked Satanic sources and they talk about the same thing about how demons are really attractive and sexually perform better than any human).
Those so called “demons” just come from the names of things in pre-Christian religions, so to the sorts of holy people who believe (or believed) in that sort of thing they're just as holy and good as Jesus and any saint.

Heh, I know this is getting way off-topic here, but from all I've learned about the world and all I've read it is exactly the people who point out the evils of “demons” who commit atrocities and do all sorts of nasty things because they're the ones who believe in a supernatural form of evil to begin with- So that justifies (to their mind) any horrible or strange things they do to other people to “fight” it, and if they find they like doing that sort of thing then they claim they were possessed by that evil.

-I'm not bashing religion or Christianity here, just the sorts of people who get nutty about “demons” and supernatural evil. The irony is that those people tend to be the closest we have to such things themselves.

Like who? The Inquisition? The Crusades? The Vatican? The Spanish conquistadores who did alot of atrocities to places like Mexico, Philippines, etc? The pedophile priests?

And what about other “christian” outfits that demand 10% or more of your total income…

Any REAL Christian I've talked to disowns the Vatican and all the big mainline churches(protestant, mormon, baptist, united, anglican, etc.). Because if you go to them, they are spiritually bankrupt.

The size of the church is directly proportional to how spiritually bankrupt they are.

They do not teach their people higher spiritual concepts like the chakra centers, etc. They refuse to talk about the federal reserve, the bankers, the new world order, etc. They talk about worshiping government because government is of the lord… then they talk about this rapture or some other variant that says “sit down and shut up and leave it all to Jesus!”

Meanwhile, the bible (Psalm 94:16) says that you must stand against the wicked. Any real Christian I've talked to who is fighting the New World Order would tell me that so what if Jesus is coming tomorrow? I'll keep on fighting until the day he returns.

Anyway, demons (or non-human negative entities… the debate for me is whether they are demons or aliens or from another dimension… not whether they exist or not) are REAL. They have attacked me often.

Closing your eyes and saying “they don't exist” won't negate their existence.

There is more to this world than what the mainstream (media, religion, science, etc.) would tell you.

NOW UPDATING!!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:27PM
ozoneocean at 9:03AM, July 10, 2010
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kyupol
Like who? The Inquisition? The Crusades? The Vatican? The Spanish conquistadores who did alot of atrocities to places like Mexico, Philippines, etc? The pedophile priests?
Yes and no. Those are all just very broad mainly historical examples of abuses of power, atrocity in warfare because of aggressive colonisation, and atrocity for political purposes. None of those are specific to religious belief or unique to any institution. You have just as many examples of all the same old crap in secular life. But religion doesn't really matter here anyway.

No, I'm talking about the individuals who specifically claim they do what they do because they know all about supernatural evil, they know about the evil in others, and they know all about demons etc. And that can be anyone, from any religion or no religion, it doesn't matter. What matters is that they're the ones telling others where the evil is and who the demons are and then doing the horrible things to others because of that.

-Osama Bin Laden claiming the West is evil so his terrorist group should kill anyone they feel like.
-GWB claiming that all of Afghanistan was the same thing as Al-Qa'ida so causing the entire country to be engulfed in war, not to mention the lies about Iraq and “eveil” Saddam Hussein and subsequent war there.
-Iranian judges who order the stoning of women for adultery.
-Those fundamentalist families in the US and UK who killed their kids because they were trying to get rid of their “demons”.

And so on. Needless violence and cruelty only because people have a fundamental belief in evil, which in objective reaity makes them the “evil” ones.

Hahaha! WAY off topic! :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:36PM
Product Placement at 9:53AM, July 10, 2010
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It's a common practice to demonize your enemy/target in order to justify your actions. After all, if you're doing evil things to someone who's evil, then surely it's forgivable. Even the Nazis tried that, by placing the fault of them loosing WWI solely on the Jews.


And this topic is indeed of way of it's track. Better try to mend things by quoting my bible.

Those were my two cents.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 2:53PM
BffSatan at 4:33AM, July 11, 2010
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kyupol
stuff…
Sounds hawt.

Oh, btw, I'm changing my username to BffWithBenefitsSatan.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:21AM
Aurora Moon at 4:37PM, July 11, 2010
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you know, kupol, you're not exactly making a strong case of why you shouldn't have sex with somebody outside of your species.

Instead, you're making it sound even more appealing. Mind-blowing sex with an highly attractive humanoid creature and you suffer the same sort of side-effect that you might get if you were withdrawing from happy pills such as Prozac?

sounds especially appealing to a lot of people, especially if the depression is mainly temporary, and goes away in a few days or so. :p

so it's like pretty much you get depressed afterward sure… but at least you had mind-blowing sex and pleasure that possibly lasted hours first before you get depressed.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TruffautWasRight

;)
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
bravo1102 at 12:29AM, July 12, 2010
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Sexual taboos are all about consent. That animal/minor/etc cannot give legal/moral consent to have sexual activity so don't do it.

It's the same with incubi and succubi. It's implied in most of the literature that the sex is not consensual. The person is asleep and the demon comes ‘round the person is aroused and there is sex.

“No” means “no”. If the subject can’t say “no” then they do not consent so don't have sex with them.

Humans are nearly unique in our sexual appetities and how we approach potential sexual partners. We don't do it like a lot of other animals do. Women do not go into heat, we can have intercourse facing each other with all the personal interaction and recognition that implies (fathers are known not anonymous leading to family bonding which assists with our long and reasonably dehabilitating pregnancy and very very long offspring maturation. It takes ten-twelve-sixteen years before the offspring is sexually mature and can care for itself.) And another huge difference between the genus Homo and most other animals; we enjoy it. We enjoy it a lot. We enjoy it so much we developed a whole psychological guilt complex about it. Give all that up and enjoy it and be what your species evolved to be. We're sexual beings and there is nothing wrong with that. But that's sex with a partner that can consent and that ain't a sheep.

Furries are humans with ears and tails stuck on them, not true animals. Fictional alien species are people with ears or brow ridges glued on. There was an episode of ST-TNG that explained that all humanoid species (Klingon, Cardassian, Human, Vulcan/Romulan) were all descended from a single ancestral species so they're all species in one genus and can interbreed. Just like humans and chimpanzees because we may have a closer relationship than our anthropomorphic hubris allows us
to admit.

Human females are capable of giving or refusing consent. Most other species can't and sexually immature humans are often classified as being unable to so they can be preserved for breeding. That's a whole other topic as that goes into sex roles in culture and women as property etc etc and can be addressed another time.

Lots of works on primate sexuality, sexual behavior and sexual choice bear this all out. It's proven in the literature. Whether your vision of your identity as a human allows you to accept it or not is another question. For many it has become a question of faith, not of evidence.

Time to refresh the missus. ;)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:33AM
meemjar at 11:47AM, Aug. 21, 2010
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Brother, you guys really took this topic to the extreme!

All I wanted was a simple answer to this scenario,

A Human encounters a creature of the opposite sex but another species.
A fox-like creature (for example) that evolved from a Fox the way Humans evolved from simians. The creature is bipedal, uses its forepaws as hands, is fully intelligent (at least equal to Human)and can fully articulate multiple languages if taught. In short they are only ‘Human’ in that they are equally sentient, not animalised humans. It is not a furry or a human in costume. It is a species onto itself but equal to a human in sentience.

Then this creature and the human find a mutual attraction in spite of their differences and have sex.
In my opinion, it would not be bestiality because its with a fully consenting, intelligent creature, it would be interspecies.

Furthermore if it wasn't consenting it would be Rape not Bestiality.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:58PM
El Cid at 11:26AM, Aug. 23, 2010
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I think the question you seem to be asking is less interesting than the question people are answering. As for whether the scenario you've laid out meets either a legal or dictionary definition of “bestiality,” that's pretty easy to answer. Interspecies sex involving humans is by definition bestiality. I've never heard of an intelligence/ sentience exception. Similarly I don't know of any such exception in any legal codes (“Sure I had hot sloppy sex with my cow, but she's one smart cow!” ).

The more interesting question goes to the moral element involved. I think maybe you're equating whether or not something meets the definition of “bestiality” with whether or not it's a moral act, but in fact the two have no bearing on each other whatsoever. In that regard, Bravo hit the nail on the head in that what matters is consent. If the humanoid animal has the ability to give its consent, and that consent is given, then any niggling aspersions against such a union are as frivolous as those against any other form of sodomy (and it IS an act of sodomy). It falls under the umbrella of “no harm, no foul, but seriously dude what the hell is wrong with you.”

Most interesting of all I think is, if no consent is given, would that qualify as rape from a moral perspective? Clearly we do all kinds of other horrific things to non-human animals all the time without batting an eye, including killing and eating them. But in the case that it's an intelligent and self-aware creature, things get more complicated. You have to really ponder just under what circumstances do you offer another life form, be they extraterrestrial or exotic terrestrial, the protections offered to your fellow man. I'd be hard-pressed to come up with a rationally consistent reasoning for it, but my gut feeling is that the non-human aspect basically amounts to the other entity being “foreign.” In that case, they should be treated as endowed with all the moral capital of any foreigner.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:20PM

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