Debate and Discussion

Obama hates babies...
PIT_FACE at 9:28PM, April 13, 2008
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Comicracy
Im just stating what he said, I didnt say it, he did. Why is it that whenever a “controversy” brakes over Obama all you lefties want to blame fox news when the other agencies cover it just as much. Im sorry the liberals have dominated the media for the last 50 years and now you have some opiniated conservatives to throw it in your face, as soon as that happens you “open minded” individuals want to slam the door on free speech. How hypocritical. What a bunch of nazi brown shirt facists you are.

man, i understand all ya did was make a thread on the basis of what you maade at that one moment, just make sure you dont do it again, allright, sweety?
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:44PM
Comicracy at 3:10AM, April 14, 2008
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Huh?
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:44AM
SpANG at 5:26AM, April 14, 2008
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Comicracy
He's a pro abortion politician. Like it or not you cant argue that. MMKAY.
Awesome! He's got my vote.
“To a rational mind, nothing is inexplicable. Only unexplained.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:53PM
lothar at 5:55AM, April 14, 2008
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Comicracy
Your taking what I said out of context, I admitted I dont think he hates babies, in one of my statements above, I knew that it would get peoples attention to talk about the facts of what he did actually say, thats why I made the post that he hates babies, to get your attention to the real issue. He's a pro abortion politician. Like it or not you cant argue that. MMKAY.

so by that logic i could say “the republicans hate all the people on Earth” i think my statement is more truthfull !

SpANG
Awesome! He's got my vote.
mine 2
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
Aurora Moon at 8:08AM, April 14, 2008
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and you're missing the point that so many people here have made. Nowhere in his statement did he say that he was “pro-abortion”. Yes, he was talking at a planned parenthood meeting but as somebody else here pointed out, they don't talk about abortion as the first thing to do. The organization talks about how to take care of babies, talking about adoption as an alternative method to abortion, etc. In short, planned parenthood is all about educating you how to take care of children, and also offering you ALL the options if you don't feel like you're ready to be a parent.

So for all you know, He could had been talking about having his own children put up their own children for adoption if they were too young to take care of their own offspring properly. All he was saying was this: “I don't want my children to become burdened with something that they are not ready for just because they weren't educated properly about safe sex and birth control. I don't want them to be burdened with a massive responsibility that could destroy their own future just because they made made a mistake in using birth control incorrectly.”

How does that scream “pro-abortion” to you? Explain that, please.

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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
SpANG at 8:23AM, April 14, 2008
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For the record…

Barack Obama in his book "The Audacity of Hope
handed me a pamphlet. “Mr. Obama, I know you're a Christian, with a family of your own. So how can you support murdering babies?”

I told him I understood his position but had to disagree with it. I explained my belief that few women made the decision to terminate a pregnancy casually; that any pregnant woman felt the full force of the moral issues involved when making that decision; that I feared a ban on abortion would force women to seek unsafe abortions, as they had once done in this country. I suggested that perhaps we could agree on ways to reduce the number of women who felt the need to have abortions in the first place.

“I will pray for you,” the protester said. “I pray that you have a change of heart.” Neither my mind nor my heart changed that day, nor did they in the days to come. But that night, before I went to bed, I said a prayer of my own-that I might extend the same presumption of good faith to others that had been extended to me.

But Aurora Moon and many others are correct. Planned Parenthood understood what he was saying. Intelligent people know what he was saying, including you, I'd suspect. You are just trying to spin it to sound like you want people to hear.

Besides, if a hyper-Christain like Bush has been in charge for EIGHT YEARS, and there has never been a bill passed to make it illegal, what makes you think that it will EVER be?

This is one of those “hot button” issues that people like to bring up around election time. But nothing will ever over-turn the decision. It's the greatest “dangling carrot” conservatives can have over thier minions.
“To a rational mind, nothing is inexplicable. Only unexplained.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:53PM
willlapuerta at 11:28AM, April 14, 2008
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Comicracy
Your taking what I said out of context . . .

*Laughs quietly in the corner*
“I am just a humble servant with a message here for you.”
-You Can't Take It With You, Alan Parson's Project
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:50PM
Comicracy at 11:33AM, April 14, 2008
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The president can only appoint supreme court justices they are the ones who vote on whether abortion should be legal or not. Congress votes on who can or cant be in the supreme court. The president has his hands tied and I am pretty sure it will always be legal, the point I made is that Obama is an abortion supporter, stop trying to make him into this enlightened being by saying it is all about education and understanding, those are softball words tossed around by the media who has been supporting democrats for the last fifty years. Its like saying, well he doesnt support the death penalty he is in favor of educating people. Education has nothing to do with it. And for the record, if Republicans hate people, why did Democrats get us into all the major wars in history? Civil War (supported slavery) WW2, Vietnam (Kennedy), Iran (Jimmy Carter) clearly Democrats have led to way more destructive wars, read your damn history lessons before you make any more stupid statements.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:44AM
imshard at 12:03PM, April 14, 2008
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The Willfully ignorant will remain so. No reason nor argument proof nor evidence can dissuade them from their blissful illusions.
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plas at 12:33PM, April 14, 2008
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The Willfully ignorant will remain so. No reason nor argument proof nor evidence can dissuade them from their blissful illusions.

Quoted for truth.
I has no picture :(
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM
bobhhh at 2:15PM, April 14, 2008
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Im just stating what he said, I didnt say it, he did. Why is it that whenever a “controversy” brakes over Obama all you lefties want to blame fox news when the other agencies cover it just as much. Im sorry the liberals have dominated the media for the last 50 years and now you have some opiniated conservatives to throw it in your face, as soon as that happens you “open minded” individuals want to slam the door on free speech. How hypocritical. What a bunch of nazi brown shirt facists you are.

So you think a 12 year old girl having a baby is a blessing? How screwed up is that. I applaud him for trying to inject some common sense into the discussion.
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
7384395948urhfdjfrueruieieueue at 2:20PM, April 14, 2008
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Comicracy
Im sorry the liberals have dominated the media for the last 50 years

And you guys control the rest of the world, seems fair.
i will also like to know you the more
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:07AM
lothar at 4:05PM, April 14, 2008
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why did Democrats get us into all the major wars in history?
huh? is this thing going on in Iraq not a major war? it's lasted longer than WWII now
and uh , Carter started a major war with Iran? i thought that was mcCains job, do they have some sort of time machine now .

last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
Comicracy at 7:03PM, April 14, 2008
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Like I said go get a history lesson, Carter supported the overthrow of the Iranian Shaw, which was replaced by the Ayahtollah (sp) this led to the first Gulf war, which was the war between Iraq and Iran, in which hundreds of thousands died. Thanks Jimmy, this also led to the spread of islamic extremism, the kind we see in Iran today, the kind that advocates the stoning of women, just bury them up to their necks in dirt, as well as the execution of homosexuals on a daily basis. Now to compare Iraq to Vietnam, WW2, is kinda silly, seeing as the death tolls dwarfed any seen from Iraq. But hey when we left Vietnamn only 10 million people were slaughtered by the communist. So yah, compare Iraq to vietnamn, heres some kool-aid why dont you have a sip.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:44AM
willlapuerta at 7:35PM, April 14, 2008
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. . . heres some kool-aid why dont you have a sip.

. . . that sounded a little unnecessary . . .
“I am just a humble servant with a message here for you.”
-You Can't Take It With You, Alan Parson's Project
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:50PM
imshard at 8:01PM, April 14, 2008
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Maybe it was harsh, but Comicracy makes a valid point for once. I do think that Iraq is comparable to Vietnam in one way however. Not in the way they are alike but unlike. Iraq is a war run on the lessons learned in places like Vietnam. As a result we still hold the country instead of having lost substantial ground to the enemy. Also while both could be classified as guerrilla wars the Coalition forces are not fighting an organized military backed by a legitimate country.


Back on point of thread: Obama is pro-abortion. End of story, no two ways about it.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:58PM
plas at 10:29PM, April 14, 2008
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Obama is pro-abortion.

Can someone really be pro-abortion? pro-choice yes, but not pro-abortion. This may be just a semantic point here but its not as if he's really going around screaming “Abortions for all!” Being pro-choice is something quite different, and while some may not agree with the choice to abort, no one on either side of the argument really believes that abortions are the best possible option… at least none that I know of…
I has no picture :(
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM
lothar at 4:32AM, April 15, 2008
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ok Iraq is not a major war just like the invasion of Afganistan was not a major war for the USSR .
Iraq is not a major war because the corpoate controlled media chooses not to make it apear so.

f you think being pro choice is somehow worse than invading a country for no good reason and killing hundreds of thousands of their citizens, you have problems .

btw -history depends very much on who is telling the story , i'm not defending the democrats here, but the republicans have a way of spinning most of the blame their way. who was rumsfeld working for when he was hanging out with saddam anyway ?
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
radarig at 9:26AM, April 15, 2008
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Like I said go get a history lesson, Carter supported the overthrow of the Iranian Shaw, which was replaced by the Ayahtollah (sp) this led to the first Gulf war, which was the war between Iraq and Iran, in which hundreds of thousands died. Thanks Jimmy, this also led to the spread of islamic extremism, the kind we see in Iran today, the kind that advocates the stoning of women, just bury them up to their necks in dirt, as well as the execution of homosexuals on a daily basis. Now to compare Iraq to Vietnam, WW2, is kinda silly, seeing as the death tolls dwarfed any seen from Iraq. But hey when we left Vietnamn only 10 million people were slaughtered by the communist. So yah, compare Iraq to vietnamn, heres some kool-aid why dont you have a sip.

Carter didn't so much support the overthrow of the Shah than shut off the sale of weapons to his military; aid to Tehran stopped in the late sixties as oil revenues were making the country richer, which resulted in Nixon and Ford adopting a policy of selling weaponry to Iran. It's important to remember that the Shah and his father before him had horrible human rights records, and Carter didn't want to support that. The fallacy in your argument is that you're suggesting that Carter should have had the foresight to anticipate everything subsequent to the Shah's deposing.

Anyway, you're ignoring the fact that Iran slid into that state and into war with Iraq during and due to actions of the Reagan administration. I presume that doesn't fit with your “Democrats start all the wars” theory.

I'll agree with you that comparing Iraq to any other war is silly, since they're unarguably different circumstances. But I disagree with your implication that Iraq isn't as serious as the other two; any time we're involved in a military conflict in which thousands of our soldiers die every year, that's serious, so much so that we shouldn't belittle the suffering by making it seem like it's all relative. Try preaching comparative value of life to a family who's lost a son or daughter in the war, then make that argument.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:58PM
Aurora Moon at 9:42AM, April 15, 2008
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Obama is pro-abortion.

Can someone really be pro-abortion? pro-choice yes, but not pro-abortion. This may be just a semantic point here but its not as if he's really going around screaming “Abortions for all!” Being pro-choice is something quite different, and while some may not agree with the choice to abort, no one on either side of the argument really believes that abortions are the best possible option… at least none that I know of…


I have to agree here. I've never even once ran into a human being that said: “Every time somebody gets pregant, They SHOULD have an abortion right away!!”
all the pro-choice people I've met, along with myself has basically thought along the lines of:
“Abortion shouldn't be the first choice you pick instantly. In most normal situations, the people conidsering it should condiser all the options out there…whenever they can afford to remain pregant and give it up for adoption if they can. etc. But in the end abortion should be allowed for everyone if they want to, espeically in the cases of rape and incest.”

Of course I have strong opinions about the foster/adoption progess being a total joke. You won't believe how many horror stories there are about abusive foster and adoptive parents out there… and I've seen it happen to kids too perosnally when I was friends with kids who were adopted. So as an result, I don't think putting up kids for adoption is really that better than Abortion as seeing you're basically gambling with a child's life– will the child end up in a good home, or will he/she just become one of the many abused kids of foster-care or adoption horror stories? But I disgress…

Pro-choice is not being pro-abortion. I wish people out there would learn the fucking difference. But of course, it's much easier to be like a fuckin' hardcore fundie. “Everything that I don't agree with at all is a fuckin' SIN!!! Everyone don't argee with me is my ENEMY!! So I'm going to do my best to paint all those people as immoral monsters! I agree with bombing others in the name of GOD/AMERICA/ETC in a war even though millions of men, women and children have died!! but I won't allow for a woman having a choice over her OWN BODY!!!”
I'm on hitatus while I redo one of my webcomics. Be sure to check it out when I'n done! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:10AM
bobhhh at 9:46AM, April 15, 2008
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Like I said go get a history lesson, Carter supported the overthrow of the Iranian Shaw, which was replaced by the Ayahtollah (sp) this led to the first Gulf war, which was the war between Iraq and Iran, in which hundreds of thousands died. Thanks Jimmy, this also led to the spread of islamic extremism, the kind we see in Iran today, the kind that advocates the stoning of women, just bury them up to their necks in dirt, as well as the execution of homosexuals on a daily basis. Now to compare Iraq to Vietnam, WW2, is kinda silly, seeing as the death tolls dwarfed any seen from Iraq. But hey when we left Vietnamn only 10 million people were slaughtered by the communist. So yah, compare Iraq to vietnamn, heres some kool-aid why dont you have a sip.

You don't know what you are talking about. Carter gave the Shah sanctuary, infuriating the Khomeini. Then when the moderate mullahs tried to repair US Iranian Relations, we smacked away their hand of freindship and refused to extradite the Shah to stand trial for4 crimes against his people.

That's what bought us decades of bad blood with Iran. To suggest we supported the Ayatollah is just plain bass ackwards.

And that had little to do with the first gulf war, except that we supported Hussein simply because he was at war with Iran at the time.

Here's the history lesson. We supported Hussein in his efforts to halt the Iranians efforts at Jihad, even though he was an even more brutal dictator than the Shah was. So when the war was over and Hussein needed to sell oil to replenish his coffers, the wise asses in Kuwait,Cousins of the Saudis, lowered the price of oil in a n effort to destablize his regime and gain influence. The final nail in the coffin was the discovery that they were slant drilling for oil across the border.

Hussein was furious after fighting what hebelieved was a noble war to keep the shia infidel from overunning the civilized sunni world, he was btrayed by his fellow sunni bretheren. Still a good soldier on the CIA payroll, he consulted with us first, and we gave him the greenlight.

Then came the call from the Saudi's who yanked their chain on Bush and told him to save their cousins. Bush, a former spook himself was reticent to get involved, but the pressure from the saudis, coupled with the desire for some of the old cold warriors to show off our new weapons and scare the russians won out.

suddenly their were billboards with pictures of hitler, stalin and hussein in an effort to sell our buttinski war between two countries we had no business interfering with. As if being a bad man was a reason to invade a sovereign nation. If that were true we would be bombing Saudi Arabia.

And you wonder why hussein swore a blood feud against us? was it becdause he hated freedom or a double cross?

People often get smug and defensive when you say we earned all this emnity from the rdical islamists, but the fact remains, if we had spent a fraction of what we gave bin laden to fight the soviets to then build schools and hospitals, he might not have grown to hate us and drop the worls trade center.

Had we given the Shah to Khomeini for trial and made peace with the moderate element in Iran, we wouldn't be considering bombing them today.

It's called blowback and its the result of selfish, smallminded, short sighted covert policies, that always end up being paid for by us in the blood of our young people.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
bobhhh at 9:49AM, April 15, 2008
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imshard
Obama is pro-abortion.

Can someone really be pro-abortion? pro-choice yes, but not pro-abortion. This may be just a semantic point here but its not as if he's really going around screaming “Abortions for all!” Being pro-choice is something quite different, and while some may not agree with the choice to abort, no one on either side of the argument really believes that abortions are the best possible option… at least none that I know of…

Yeah why not just call him anti-life?
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:30AM
Kohdok at 11:19AM, April 15, 2008
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Comicracy
The president can only appoint supreme court justices they are the ones who vote on whether abortion should be legal or not. Congress votes on who can or cant be in the supreme court. The president has his hands tied and I am pretty sure it will always be legal, the point I made is that Obama is an abortion supporter, stop trying to make him into this enlightened being by saying it is all about education and understanding, those are softball words tossed around by the media who has been supporting democrats for the last fifty years. Its like saying, well he doesnt support the death penalty he is in favor of educating people. Education has nothing to do with it. And for the record, if Republicans hate people, why did Democrats get us into all the major wars in history? Civil War (supported slavery) WW2, Vietnam (Kennedy), Iran (Jimmy Carter) clearly Democrats have led to way more destructive wars, read your damn history lessons before you make any more stupid statements.



Your “Point” has already been de-bunked several times. The dead horse has been beaten enough, thank you.

As for those wars of yours, You seem to be forgetting the two wars we've had against Iraq with the current Republican presidents. The Civil War was started when the Democrats were conservative like the Republicans are today. That's only changed within the past 50~60 years. So you're admitting Conservatives are pro-slavery, then? If not, then why did the ultra-conservative south switch to Republican when LBJ (a democrat) signed the civil rights act?

Now for WWII: WE didn't start it. We were one of the last nations to join it and we had no choice because we were directly attacked by another nation (Before you get into that, 9/11 wasn't on the orders of the top members of a country, it was a little terrorist group). FDR avoided was as long as he possibly could.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:20PM
kingofsnake at 11:33AM, April 15, 2008
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Comicracy
You're taking what I said out of context

BEST IRONY EVER
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:16PM
willlapuerta at 11:44AM, April 15, 2008
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Comicracy
You're taking what I said out of context

BEST IRONY EVER

I think you can find it in the dictionary under the definition of Irony.
“I am just a humble servant with a message here for you.”
-You Can't Take It With You, Alan Parson's Project
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:50PM
Comicracy at 4:38AM, April 16, 2008
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Hey I havent been here in a while I see all you are still drinking the kool aid and believing the first thing you read/see about Barrack, your golden calf is being propped up by the media long enough. How can we have a president with ties to a known terrorist, how can we have a president whos wife has never been proud of america until her adult life, how can we have a president who belittles middle class americans in throughout the country by stating they cling to their guns and religion because they are bitter. He is a socialist marxist elitist. Vote him in and prepare for socialized medicine, which even the canadians admit is a failure. Vote him in, the man who has in proposed a bill to increase our national deficit by 845 trillion dollars, to turn over our own soldiers to a the Corrupt UN courts. You people are so blinded by your man love for Barrack and his pretty speaches. Ask yourself why do politicians want to grant amnesty for illegals and love socialized programs like welfare, its because they want to keep a permanent underclass of citizens, that they can CONTROL, A big government babysitting the people, well be a baby then and let the Government take care of it, thats what you'll get with Obama.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:44AM
lothar at 6:14AM, April 16, 2008
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Hey I havent been here in a while I see all you are still drinking the kool aid and believing the first thing you read/see about Barrack, your golden calf is being propped up by the media long enough. How can we have a president with ties to a known terrorist, how can we have a president whos wife has never been proud of america until her adult life, how can we have a president who belittles middle class americans in throughout the country by stating they cling to their guns and religion because they are bitter. He is a socialist marxist elitist. Vote him in and prepare for socialized medicine, which even the canadians admit is a failure. Vote him in, the man who has in proposed a bill to increase our national deficit by 845 trillion dollars, to turn over our own soldiers to a the Corrupt UN courts. You people are so blinded by your man love for Barrack and his pretty speaches. Ask yourself why do politicians want to grant amnesty for illegals and love socialized programs like welfare, its because they want to keep a permanent underclass of citizens, that they can CONTROL, A big government babysitting the people, well be a baby then and let the Government take care of it, thats what you'll get with Obama.

heh , oh wow ~! i guess the kool aid aint so bad , compared to whatever the hell you've been drinking.
hmm
terrorists friends (the saudis), belittles the middle class (“i wear a coboy hat, im one of you”), elitist(Sunnyvale Ca.), racking up the deficit(+6 trillion), desire for a permanent underclass(no child left behind act), big government babysitting the people(dept of homeland security), i think we already got all these things from george freekin bush !!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
ozoneocean at 7:03AM, April 16, 2008
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Yeah… the argument's a little shrill and as Lothar deftly points out (as usual), it's pretty transparent when a lot of that is what you already have with the current regime. It makes me think that there isn't any real argument, just plain ideology: Not liking the man because he represents a good hope for the “other” side, who are evil by default.

Fair enough, plenty of people hate George Jnr for the same reason. But idealogical diatribes are entirely one sided and not very interesting. At least not to me. :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:30PM
kingofsnake at 9:58AM, April 16, 2008
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ozoneocean
Yeah… the argument's a little shrill and as Lothar deftly points out (as usual), it's pretty transparent when a lot of that is what you already have with the current regime. It makes me think that there isn't any real argument, just plain ideology: Not liking the man because he represents a good hope for the “other” side, who are evil by default.

Fair enough, plenty of people hate George Jnr for the same reason. But idealogical diatribes are entirely one sided and not very interesting. At least not to me. :)


Yes, your strawman arguments are unwelcome here Mr. O'Riley. Perhaps its not the wisest strategy to throw rocks from your house of glass?

Heres the thing, I used to be pro-Mccain, but as this thing moves forward I'm becoming increasingly more pro-Obama. (I was never really pro-Clinton. I think, with the amount of time we will be spending in the middle east, where women are looked upon as second class citizens, having a woman president would make it even more complicated. America is ready for a woman president, but the rest of the world isn't ready to accept America as having a woman president, and as long as we're meddling in other country's affairs, we need to consider that.) The media keeps throwing this kind of ridiculous bullshit at Obama, and it keeps rolling off him because he is honest and straight-forward with dealing with it. But mostly I think after the Bush administration our country needs a president like Obama more than one like Mccain. Mccain would've made a great president, the first time he ran in 2000, but I just don't think it's the right time for him anymore.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:16PM
Comicracy at 10:12AM, April 16, 2008
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Funny, you cant attack the points I just made so you have to attack the other candidates, right out of the liberal playbook as always. Next will come the personel attacks. Oh wait they already have. You open minded people are funny. Im not trying to defend any other candidate, just bring to attention the huge flaws of the marxist obama.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:44AM

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