General Discussion

So I noticed recently that some people are posting the same comic page more then once.....
Product Placement at 5:55PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 7,078
joined: 10-18-2007
Sometimes when I post a comic page I check, for curiosities sake, for how long my comic stays on the front page, inside the “this just in” list. Usually it isn't very long but every once in a while I notice that some comics pop back on the list as soon as they're bumped of it. Just now I noticed a comic who's name will remain anonymous (unless an admin wants to know who it is) popping up on the list but it just so happens that I looked at it yesterday and it's the same page he updated the day before.

Now for those who don't understand where I'm going with this, let me explain. Some comic makers are posting their newest page over and over again so that they get more “screen time”. They do that by deleting their newest page and then go on uploading it again. The site notices that he has a new page and the comic goes back on the “this just in” list. I tried it the last time I updated, once, to check if my theory was correct and it worked like a charm.

Now I'm curious. Did I just discover something that everyone already knew of? Do people generally care that this exploit is being practiced? Do people find this unfair or is the general consent that this is ok and everyone should take advantage of this?
Those were my two cents.
If you have any other questions, please deposit a quarter.
This space for rent.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:49PM
Bocaj at 6:21PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 3,278
joined: 4-3-2007
I knew that worked.
I don't think it is that big a deal. If people want to waste time doing that for just a little more time on the front page, then fine.
There stuff still has to be quality for people (or at least me), to read it.

There is one downside to doing that, though.
Any comments on the page the first time you posted it would get deleted.

I personally think it is a bit of a waste of time considering that not to many people browse the main page, although that is just my opinion.


It is, I guess, a tad selfish (hogging the front page), but meh.

Don't read Rape.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:32AM
Custard Trout at 6:24PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(offline)
posts: 4,566
joined: 2-22-2007
Product Placement
ominous

The word you're looking for is ‘anonymous’. Ominous is that feeling you get just before something horrible happens.

As the rest of it, it's been reported loads of times, but it's kind of a hard thing to control. You should just report it to the admins or something.
Hey buddy, you should be a Russian Cosmonaut, and here's why.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:01PM
NickGuy at 6:25PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 988
joined: 2-22-2007
Bocaj
I knew that worked.
I don't think it is that big a deal. If people want to waste time doing that for just a little more time on the front page, then fine.
There stuff still has to be quality for people (or at least me), to read it.

There is one downside to doing that, though.
Any comments on the page the first time you posted it would get deleted.

I personally think it is a bit of a waste of time considering that not to many people browse the main page, although that is just my opinion.


It is, I guess, a tad selfish (hogging the front page), but meh.
wow, THATS incredibly apathetic.

I think it is in incredible bad taste to do that. are you that worried that people arent seeing your comic? how bout you just gain readership the right way.

“Kung Fu Komix IS…hardcore martial art action all the way. 8/10” -Harkovast
“Kung Fu Komix is that rare comic that is made with heart and love of the medium, and it delivers” -Zenstrive
“Kung Fu Komix is…so awesome” -threeeyeswurm
“Kung Fu Komix is..told with all the stupid exuberance of the genre it parodies” -The Real Macabre
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:15PM
Product Placement at 7:13PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 7,078
joined: 10-18-2007
Custard Trout
Product Placement
ominous

The word you're looking for is ‘anonymous’. Ominous is that feeling you get just before something horrible happens.

Yeah I know. It was an oversight on my behalf. Thanks for pointing it out. It's been fixed.
Those were my two cents.
If you have any other questions, please deposit a quarter.
This space for rent.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:49PM
usedbooks at 7:22PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(offline)
posts: 2,608
joined: 2-24-2007
Sometimes, I know people actually delete and reupload because they catch an error and haven't figured out that they can just edit the page.

Other times, I'm sure it's a deliberate attempt to “cheat.” I don't think I'd worry about it too much though. There are some pathetic people who have found much more effective and less tedious ways to “cheat” for pageviews. The “recently updated” list really won't earn you many new readers or views anyway. Most of the comics I follow all update at that midnight/1 o'clock turnover and are actually never on the front page.

So, not only is it pathetic, it's ineffective and even counter-productive if they are losing comments from it.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:37PM
Ironscarfs Ghost at 7:28PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(offline)
posts: 577
joined: 9-12-2008
Product Placement
Yeah I know. It was an oversight on my behalf. Thanks for pointing it out. It's been fixed.
I was prepared to accept it as a deliberate play on words that was far too clever for me to understand actually. Now you've changed it I feel even stupider-er.

As for this multiple posting of the same page, it would be nice if the site could be tweaked so that all those individual posts could be counted in the stats. This would mean that, if you posted the same page ten times and got 100 page views, the pageview count would be ten instead of 100. I'm sure that's not possible, but I find thinking about it quite satisfying.
Er……..boo!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:03PM
ozoneocean at 7:57PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 24,965
joined: 1-2-2004
There used to be a system in place that if they did that their comic would not be marked as “new” again until after a whole week had passed. :)

That was funny when the cheaters saw in dismay they'd screwed themselves… But not fair on the people used books talk about who genuinely make mistakes or need to change a page. There were probably more of those than the moron cheaters.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:32PM
Skullbie at 9:35PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 4,754
joined: 12-9-2007
I've seen this happen, usually it's sprite comics and manga comics that do it. Personally I don't care since I doubt it gets them more than a handful of views.
Seems almost every comic on smakjeeves does this tho lol!
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:46PM
lba at 10:00PM, Nov. 28, 2008
(online)
posts: 2,686
joined: 5-29-2007
I just figured it was better to keep them occupied by reloading pages than having them figure out real ways to cause mischief and havoc.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:29PM
Ryan_Scott at 2:35AM, Nov. 29, 2008
(online)
posts: 309
joined: 10-5-2008
What's more important to you as an artist? The expression of your own thoughts and ideas, or getting an extra few views a day?
I'd personally rather be satisfied with my own and have a few people who genuinely dig it, than have more people read my shit just because it shows up on the front page and my thumbnail looks kinda interesting…
But then maybe I'm strange in that respect.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:15PM
crocty at 5:08AM, Nov. 29, 2008
(online)
posts: 6,673
joined: 8-16-2007
I know someone who purposely uploads a filetype that isn't accepted every day a few hours after their update, because it counts as a new update.

):< Whenever I see it update I usually ask him if it's really updated.

Bastard. T.T
THIS NEW SITE SUCKS I'M LEAVING FOREVER I PROMISE, GUYS.
NOT BLUFFING, I'M GONE IF YOU DON'T FIX IT.
Oh god I'm so alone someone pay attention to me
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:52AM
DAJB at 7:45AM, Nov. 29, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,462
joined: 2-23-2007
Deleting a page and re-posting it will obviously keep it on the front page longer but, if the comic has comments on that page, they'll be lost. I think that's a big enough deterrent for most people.

Of course, if a comic doesn't have any comments to lose, then it probably doesn't have many readers either. In that case I wouldn't begrudge it trying to grab a little extra attention. It's just so damn hard for a new comic to get noticed!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
Koshou at 5:09PM, Nov. 30, 2008
(offline)
posts: 198
joined: 1-19-2008
people do something similar on deviantart… changing the category of the picture so that it will get a better place on the popular page. I don't think it's fair. after all, bumping yourself up will bump someone else off…
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:21PM
Hawk at 11:07PM, Nov. 30, 2008
(online)
posts: 2,760
joined: 1-2-2006
Some people haven't figured out that if you just make a quality comic worth reading, then word of mouth will make your readership grow. I'll bet the people who feel like they have to cheat to gain readership have comics that aren't really worth reading.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
DAJB at 3:03AM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,462
joined: 2-23-2007
Hawk
Some people haven't figured out that if you just make a quality comic worth reading, then word of mouth will make your readership grow. I'll bet the people who feel like they have to cheat to gain readership have comics that aren't really worth reading.
I think that's probably a little harsh. I read some great comics here that just don't seem to be able to secure the attention which (I think!) they deserve, while the top comics include some very average titles. Word of mouth can be a bad thing as well as a good thing!

I'm guessing that the comics doing this are still a looong way down the rankings and, if they can get a couple of extra readers by re-posting an update, then good luck to them! Is it doing any harm to other comics? I suspect not. I doubt if any comic in the top three hundred is going to have its ranking affected (positively or negatively) by this and, if your comic is outside that range, moving up or down one or two positions isn't going to hurt anyone.

It's all very well to talk about “word of mouth” but first you need some kind of a fanbase to spread that “word”.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
ozoneocean at 4:32AM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 24,965
joined: 1-2-2004
Yeah. The most successful comics I know have very motivated creators behind them. They certainly get the word out there in all sorts of ways and it can pay off very well if done right.

But that's quite a lot more than fiddling with the DD update system though… :)

I think that in the context of the DD community Hawk is spot on. But in the world wide web of net-comics, pretty much anything goes and it can indeed work for some.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:32PM
Ironscarfs Ghost at 6:25AM, Dec. 1, 2008
(offline)
posts: 577
joined: 9-12-2008
DAJB
It's all very well to talk about “word of mouth” but first you need some kind of a fanbase to spread that “word”.
Chin up old chap, it can't be that bad. I'll give you some extra pageviews: if us Brits don't stick together, we won't see these North American fellows for dust!

I suppose I can see how some creators, if they're not looking at the big picture, could get hooked on watching their page views fluctuate and end up trying this type of thing. It's probably not done with evil intent in most cases but as has been pointed out, in the grand scale of things, it's meaningless.

I would implore those creators to attend to the twin crafts of writing and drawing, or 3D modelling, or spriting, or whatever their vice, before giving their efforts a good old fashioned plugging. How much more satisfaction will they derive from seeing their pageviews increase after some honest hard work?

Right, I'm off to help some old ladies to cross the road.
Er……..boo!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:03PM
Hawk at 9:54AM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 2,760
joined: 1-2-2006
DAJB
I read some great comics here that just don't seem to be able to secure the attention which (I think!) they deserve, while the top comics include some very average titles.

If those comics you love are really good, you'll tell people about them. And you should. My favorite webcomic is one I'm always eager to tell people about when they're asking about good comics, and to my knowlege, this comic has never advertised at all. But it's getting pretty popular.

There's nothing wrong with plugging your comic through the proper avenues and promoting it whenever you can… but even that and cheating the DD updates don't mean squat if your comic isn't worth staying and reading.

To tell you honestly, the idea of people cheating the DD updates doesn't bother me that much… they're just wasting time they could be spending more effectively.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
DAJB at 10:53AM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 1,462
joined: 2-23-2007
Hawk
DAJB
I read some great comics here that just don't seem to be able to secure the attention which (I think!) they deserve, while the top comics include some very average titles.
If those comics you love are really good, you'll tell people about them.
I do, obviously. I've also added links to some at my own comic page and I've suggested names in the Unnoticed creative comics thread here in the forums. And this is precisely because I just don't think it's enough to blithely say that “if you make a good comic, they will come”. Frankly, it's not true. New comics, even the good ones, need a lot of help and luck before they start to build up a meaningful number of pageviews/faves. Saying that “viewing figures will take care of themselves if your comic is good enough” must be very discouraging to those who are producing high quality work but not getting that luck or help.

Ironscarfs Ghost
Chin up old chap, it can't be that bad. I'll give you some extra pageviews: if us Brits don't stick together, we won't see these North American fellows for dust!
Heh - well, I wasn't talking about my comic (I've been on here for aaages and I have a lovely fanbase who leave me lots and lots of wonderful comments!) but I just wanted to make the point that those who have been here for a while may have forgotten how difficult it is for a new comic to get noticed. If those new comics want to resort to re-posting an update, then let them. I very much doubt if it's making any significant difference to the ranking of their comic (or to anyone else's) and so it's a little unfair to condemn them as “cheats”. In their position, I'm sure a lot of currently established creators would be doing exactly the same thing!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
Hawk at 1:24PM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 2,760
joined: 1-2-2006
DAJB
I just don't think it's enough to blithely say that “if you make a good comic, they will come”. Frankly, it's not true. New comics, even the good ones, need a lot of help and luck before they start to build up a meaningful number of pageviews/faves. Saying that “viewing figures will take care of themselves if your comic is good enough” must be very discouraging to those who are producing high quality work but not getting that luck or help.

Well then it's a good thing nobody ever said any of those things, right?
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:46PM
worstcase at 3:07PM, Dec. 1, 2008
(online)
posts: 224
joined: 1-15-2007
I honestly don't think it matters, because as Skullbie says its mostly sprite and manga comics that do it. Besides, why would anyone go to the trouble of deleting their pages over and over again?

It's just stupid.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:51PM
Senshuu at 1:06AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(offline)
posts: 391
joined: 5-23-2006
Whoa, I didn't think anybody ever did that on purpose.
What a huge waste of time, lol.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:27PM
harkovast at 4:18AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(online)
posts: 5,198
joined: 10-12-2008
What people won't do for five minutes of fame.
The thing to remember though, is that if you write a piece of badly drawn, pointless, generic crap, you can spend a million years on the front page and still no one will read the thing.
Ultimately only having a quality comic will get you readers, wasting so much time on a pathetic trick (and risking getting reported to admins) cant make up for a lack of talent.
(I just posted a page so now I am going to go and see if anyone is bumping me off with this tactic!)

For more Harkovast related goings on, go to the Harkovast Forum
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:42PM
Ironscarfs Ghost at 5:00AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(offline)
posts: 577
joined: 9-12-2008
Harkovast
What people won't do for five minutes of fame.

It's almost as bad as posting thinly disguised plugs for your latest update in any vaguely related topic you can find!

If ‘Harkovast’ wasn't so uniquely brilliant, that would get old real quick. ;)

(pay me l8r k?)
Er……..boo!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:03PM
harkovast at 6:26AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(online)
posts: 5,198
joined: 10-12-2008
Ironscarf, oooh you!
You mock me with one hand and yet plug me with the other!

For more Harkovast related goings on, go to the Harkovast Forum
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:42PM
ozoneocean at 7:08AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(online)
posts: 24,965
joined: 1-2-2004
harkovast
Ironscarf, oooh you!
You mock me with one hand and yet plug me with the other!
Ewwww!
Keep your personal details private…
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:32PM
Ironscarfs Ghost at 9:39AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(offline)
posts: 577
joined: 9-12-2008
Ozoneocean
Ewwww!
Keep your personal details private…

You know you want some…

Latest Harkovast update I mean. %)
Er……..boo!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:03PM
harkovast at 9:45AM, Dec. 8, 2008
(online)
posts: 5,198
joined: 10-12-2008
Update?
Oh yeah….um…comic updates!
Of course!
Yes, Ironscarf was plugging my comic, that sounds convincing.
At least it's what I intend to tell the judge.

For more Harkovast related goings on, go to the Harkovast Forum
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:42PM

Forgot Password
©2011 WOWIO, Inc. All Rights Reserved