Drunk Duck Awards

The Judging Forum
JustNoPoint at 7:03AM, Sept. 1, 2009
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Let's get some feedback on the forum I created to manage the panelists/judges.

What did you guys think about it? Was it better than the system we used last year? Did you enjoy it? Do you want to use something similar next year? And do you have suggestions to improve things?


If we use the forum again I have 1 suggestion so far offhand.

That next year when the comic links are given… the link should lead to the page that ppl should begin their judging from.

That leaves a bit more work to those of us that have to set this up but I think it would be very convenient for the judges and push the idea that the judging takes place in 1 year increments.

I did see some pros and cons being discussed in some comics this year that were from last year or older. Didn't try to intervene too much this year on any categories… I think that will help that issue for next year.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:12PM
Aghammer at 9:11AM, Sept. 1, 2009
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I really enjoyed the forums… seemed to work like a champ. I wasn't involved last year so I can't compare. I think it would be excellent to have links to the “start” of a specific comic, for that specific year, although, personally, I tried to stay in this “year” for the comics I reviewed(except for the completed work which I felt included ALL of the comic). Also, Usedbooks included links to the “annual start” of some comics so she did that work for the rest of us (because she is is awesome like that).
last edited on July 14, 2011 10:47AM
Tantz Aerine at 9:59AM, Sept. 1, 2009
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The forum worked like a charm, was much faster and did not burden any of the judges with being the information carrier to the other two. I would second without another thought that it be done the same way next year, God willing :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:07PM
DAJB at 10:57AM, Sept. 1, 2009
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The Forum worked excellently! I had some reservations about the work involved in having to “compartmentalise” the discussions for each category, but JNP had it all well in hand and there were no problems at all.

One very, very minor technical difficulty I had was the size of the “reply” window for entering comments. Is it possible to make that larger? As you know, I'm as wordy a judge as I am a script writer and I found that - after I'd written a couple of paragraphs - the box no longer scrolled down with the text. To be clear, it did accept additional text but wouldn't keep the last few lines in view.

I suspect the system doesn't allow for that window to be increased in size but, if it there is such an option, that would be very helpful to verbose critters like me!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
Redemption at 12:46PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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I'm with what looks to be the general consensus so far - the forums worked well. I haven't been involved with the awards before so I can't compare on whether its better or worse but I can't think of anything that was sorely overlooked or needed improving on for next time.

Improved window sizes sounds like a great idea, if its possible. I ran into the same issue as DAJB. I just cut the post up into parts to submit as I wasn't sure if the hidden text would go through.

Link to the first judging page would be marvelous! It does sound like a bit of a mission for whoever gets the job of archive-trawling to finding them (unless there's a way around that), but perhaps people might be willing to volunteer. Active forum nominees might be able to provide their own, too.

Updates Thursdays.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:03PM
amanda at 2:31PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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Oh. Man.

I'm in huge favor of continuing the forum process for next year! My reservations up front involved it being offsite, but that didn't matter in the end. It was extremely useful to keep categories private and secure, and I think the method of communication was much easier than going back and forth via PQ.

The PQ system was a huge issue last year because of the mini-meltdown right about the time panels were getting started. ^.^ As one of the people responsible for making sure the Awards went smoothly, it was AWESOME to be able to see if panels were making progress. Last year, I didn't know the status on anything until people PQed me. I think I came out with fewer grey hairs than last time, even!

From a panelist standpoint, I really liked the conversational tone and pace that the forum encourages. From an admin/coordinator standpoint, I really appreciate being able to watch the progress unfold in real time.
last edited on July 14, 2011 10:52AM
Nicotine at 3:40PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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Eh, a lot of what I would say has been said. I think it worked well, and I'm speaking from the standpoint of someone who judged for the first time this year. Everything was self-explainatory, you know, just go to the forums you're appointed to and say what you think.

My biggest issue (and I'm repeating this because I think it *really* needs to be fixed, because it annoyed me) was the size of the reply box. @_@
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:16PM
usedbooks at 3:48PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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It worked a lot better this year! Less confusion, smoother communication, and the admins were able to monitor the progress and fit in new judges when needed.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:38PM
harkovast at 4:46PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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Forums worked a lot better then PQ would have as all the judges could see everything that was said so no one had to repeat anything and no one was ever excluded form the discussion.
Also it meant I coudl use project wonderful to see when thejudges were going from the judging forums to look at my comic.

For more Harkovast related goings on, go to the Harkovast Forum
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:43PM
crazyninny at 6:12PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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This was my first year judging, but I would like to comment that I did love using the forum system. =3

Was very easy to look back on what I and others wrote, and allowed me freedom of explaining my thoughts on comics. *Which I might of over done, but I don't regreat nothing.*
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:49AM
dontworrybehappy at 9:15PM, Sept. 1, 2009
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well, i agree with everyone else. first time judging and the administrators JNP and AMANDA were able to monitor the progress or no progrees of the categories.
regrets i've had a few but then again, too few to mention,
i did what i had to do and saw it through without exemption.
I planned each charted course; Each careful step along the byway,
But more, much more than this, I did it my way.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:13PM
JustNoPoint at 5:07AM, Sept. 2, 2009
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Thanks for the feedback. I was really concerned about an offsite forum as well. I wish we could get platinum to add this here so ppl wouldn't have to register there.

About the reply box size. I don't see any options to increase it's size in the admin panel. It's probably something I will have to alter in the php/html I'll see what I can do and I hope to make that more convenient for you all. Should I double the length?

I'll make sure that links point to the start of where reviews will begin for next year.

1 other issue came up that I would like to discuss. When it became crunch time I started throwing judges into categories to quicken results by getting 3 votes faster.

Now one member felt a bit railroaded after they returned and saw everything was finished. I was worried about that… I did not wish to take away from anyone's individual experiences in this.

So, my question is… should we try to do the whole “3 judges agree and winner is declared” before the 1st deadline, then with the categories that are not finished we just go by majority vote?

Or should there be a 4th judge assigned to each category if possible? This judge would be able to discuss, but their vote would NOT count unless it's needed to swing vote and/or at crunch time.

Obviously anyone with that status would have to be told and made it clear. Because they wouldn't really be casting a vote unless the above occurred. I could see a person feeling ignored like this… but it's an idea.

Any other ideas? Every judge must wear a shock collar and if they vanish for a day we shock them? XD
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:12PM
usedbooks at 2:07PM, Sept. 2, 2009
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No need to make things more complicated than necessary. Deadlines exist for a reason, after all! If the judging isn't done by the deadline, send in backup judges. If people's feelings are hurt, well, they had a deadline.

If you need to make additional “progress deadlines” of some sort to ease your mind, that could help. (Such as “all judges must check in before X date” )
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:38PM
DAJB at 2:21PM, Sept. 2, 2009
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I don't see any need to change the deadline arrangements. Everyone knows what the deadlines are and should try to keep to them. Of course, if someone can't finish by the deadline then that's entirely understandable (we all have lives outside of DD, after all*) but then the organisers have to be free to make whatever arrangements they think best.

One thing that did strike me as a little odd, though, was allowing potential judges to choose their categories. I'm sure there wasn't any wrong-doing this year but that's a mechanism which could be open to abuse in the future (two people volunteering for the same panel could effectively decide the outcome of an award). I think, if someone volunteers to be a panellist, then they should agree to accept whatever random categories are allocated to them.


* Except for Amanda and JustNoPoint, obviously! ;-)
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
usedbooks at 2:32PM, Sept. 2, 2009
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DAJB
I don't see any need to change the deadline arrangements. Everyone knows what the deadlines are and should try to keep to them. Of course, if someone can't finish by the deadline then that's entirely understandable (we all have lives outside of DD, after all*) but then the organisers have to be free to make whatever arrangements they think best.

One thing that did strike me as a little odd, though, was allowing potential judges to choose their categories. I'm sure there wasn't any wrong-doing this year but that's a mechanism which could be open to abuse in the future (two people volunteering for the same panel could effectively decide the outcome of an award). I think, if someone volunteers to be a panellist, then they should agree to accept whatever random categories are allocated to them.


* Except for Amanda and JustNoPoint, obviously! ;-)
We chose categories last year with no trouble. The problem with “random” categories is that there are a lot of things some people just plain don't like and would not want to read at all.

On the other hand, I know we tried to bar people from judging categories they judged last year. It's a good idea, but what about people who took on a lot of extra work this year and therefore would have to be barred from a LOT of categories that otherwise really need the judging power, especially from a willing volunteer. In that case, random assignment could allow for that – provided the judges are either looking at new candidates or only new material to avoid bias.

What I attempted to do personally was provide the admins a list of categories I'd be willing to judge and asking them to randomly assign me a few from that list… (Unfortunately, I guess my intentions were completely unclear because they just stuck me in ALL the categories listed. o_0 )
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:38PM
lastcall at 4:12AM, Sept. 4, 2009
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This was my first time being involved in the DD awards and I thought it went very smoothly. The judging forum was great, I had no problems with it. You guys did a great job! :)
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:28PM
jgib99 at 8:59AM, Sept. 4, 2009
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I thought that it worked great. This was also my first time as a panelist, so I can't compare it to how it was done last year. But I would keep it the same way for next year's awards.
Karen's Edge- The beginning of the wildest road trip ever!!
How Unfortunate- Coming back in mid-July!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:08PM
harkovast at 2:45PM, Sept. 4, 2009
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DAJB what are these ‘lives outside DD’ of which you speak?

I think the judging system is fine because it made me win something!
Can't argue with that!

But seriously, if someone is very late taking part in judging, they cant expect the whole process to go on hold for them.
There is a limit to how much time people can have and if time runs out majority vote is the only way to break the dead lock.

For more Harkovast related goings on, go to the Harkovast Forum
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:43PM
CZweig at 7:04PM, Sept. 4, 2009
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I'm with a few others, that this was my first year participating in the DD Awards – by the time I heard of last year's, the results were already being posted! – so I don't have the PQ system to compare to. However, I think the forum worked like a charm :) I tried to steer clear of the forum while I was working on my judging, actually – I didn't want my opinion to be swayed by the other votes – but one thing I really liked was getting to see the other judge's opinions. It felt more interactive than I imagine the PQ system would've been, discussing the comics with the other judges :)

On the topic of late judging and replacing judges, it's time consuming, but sending a reminder to an MIA judge might cut that down? It could be entirely possible that someone simply forgot, or has decided to drop out and hasn't told anyone. But on the flip side, someone who forgets to do something they volunteered to do probably isn't very into it, haha :)

On the topic of choosing which categories to judge, I actually liked that judges could choose their categories. To me, it makes more sense for someone to pick a category that they at least know something about. On the other hand, being thrown into an alien category could provide a completely impartial point of view, but if I were to judge, I don't know, something about sports, just as an example, I wouldn't even know where to start. Somehow, I think choosing categories provides better results :)

Well, as long as a judge isn't judging a category they were nominated for, of course ;)

Well in short I guess, I loved being involved, the system worked without a hitch, and it was a ton of fun. I'll definitely sign up again next year! :D
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:02PM
ttyler at 8:58PM, Sept. 4, 2009
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I'm definitely going to try to judge next year, as well as present. Hopefully, I can gain more fans and have a few nominations, because truthfully, I think thats what hurt me the most. Just not enough people to get the numbers I needed to compete. Unfortunately, I don't have other mirror sites, or knowledge of placing banners on other popular sites….so all my traffic is within the Duck. I'm just a caveman I guess…….ugh…..brain hurt now.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:34PM
mlai at 11:00PM, Sept. 4, 2009
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@ TTyler:
You mean… with your art, you haven't been able to get into that high-traffic comics-linking community that JNP is a part of? I'm sure JNP must have talked to you about it.

I want to be a judge next year as well, if the process is as smooth and improved as this year's. Debating the merits of comics on a forum sounds like fun.

FIGHT current chapter: Filling In The Gaps
FIGHT_2 current chapter: Light Years of Gold
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:06PM
ttyler at 4:50AM, Sept. 5, 2009
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mlai
@ TTyler:
You mean… with your art, you haven't been able to get into that high-traffic comics-linking community that JNP is a part of? I'm sure JNP must have talked to you about it.

I want to be a judge next year as well, if the process is as smooth and improved as this year's. Debating the merits of comics on a forum sounds like fun.

Jnp? I'm sorry bro……who is JNP? ( I was going to say, Japanese Neo-Pet Police……but I gave up my Neo-pet sex slave smuggling operation years ago.)
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:34PM
Pieguy259 at 5:01AM, Sept. 5, 2009
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JustNoPoint, I believe.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:43PM
ttyler at 5:09AM, Sept. 5, 2009
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OHHHHH…YEAH. I knew that……just making sure you guys were……uh……payin' attention.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:34PM
JustNoPoint at 5:27PM, Sept. 5, 2009
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Actually Tim got me into that Palace In The Sky. But he didn't know that he could still link to Drunk Duck when he did it and made another site IIRC

And I hope to see both of you as judges next year ^^
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:12PM
ttyler at 5:59PM, Sept. 5, 2009
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Yeah….I'm paying for that mistake as we speak.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:34PM
dontworrybehappy at 9:32AM, Sept. 8, 2009
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i liked the new system; this was my first year so i wouldn't know which is best, i just have to belive in the people who judged last year.

Someone
1 other issue came up that I would like to discuss. When it became crunch time I started throwing judges into categories to quicken results by getting 3 votes faster.

Now one member felt a bit railroaded after they returned and saw everything was finished. I was worried about that… I did not wish to take away from anyone's individual experiences in this.

So, my question is… should we try to do the whole “3 judges agree and winner is declared” before the 1st deadline, then with the categories that are not finished we just go by majority vote?

Or should there be a 4th judge assigned to each category if possible? This judge would be able to discuss, but their vote would NOT count unless it's needed to swing vote and/or at crunch time.

first, a deadline is a deadline, if you don't start posting or you leave and don't comeback until the last day means more problems for the organizers and the other judges, so you can't expect they wait for you forever.

second, i was a back up judge this year so if i get to help again as back up and i have to read the comics but my opinion doesn't really matter, unless those 2 conditions i would get mad cause i took the time to read 5 comics of a category i got the last days of judging they tell me that my post is not taken into account and i just waisted my time, who wouldn't be angry. what if a category starts but it happenes like the most improved category. you won't be able to finish on time(remember, this one was the las category and was finished the 31th at 11 o'clock.

i don't know if i explained myself well!!!!

also, about getting the categories you asked for is not something you should change. take me for example- i don't know anything about noir or like it either so judging mistery and noir would be a problem of interest and the fact that i won't know where to start, besides i think a mistery comic is messured by the number of sherlock holmes it has, if you know what i mean.

or judging backgrownd or manga where you need the knowledge for this kind of categories.
that's all i have to say!!! if i remember something, i'll post it later

regrets i've had a few but then again, too few to mention,
i did what i had to do and saw it through without exemption.
I planned each charted course; Each careful step along the byway,
But more, much more than this, I did it my way.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:13PM
JustNoPoint at 10:12AM, June 15, 2010
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For those of you that asked for bigger reply boxes I found a mod that allows it. It adds + and - buttons under the reply box. Push the + button to make the box larger ^_^

Everything else will be the same as last year.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:12PM

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