Debate and Discussion

what would happen if humanity found a common enemy?
Defilia at 12:08PM, Jan. 21, 2007
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well what if mankind had a common enemy, lets say aliens.
what would happen, would we unite, or would everything just be drowned in chaos.(of course other options are more than welcome)

looking at mankind as we stand today i think we would fall into chaos, and then reforming into a united earth.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:10PM
Mazoo at 3:31PM, Jan. 21, 2007
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We already have one: each other.

I don't believe all of mankind will ever unite under one “common idea.” There is too much prejudice and racism against everyone. Some (as in terrorists) would even see “uniting” as a kind of weakness against their cause, I suppose.

If we were ever to unite, though, it wouldn't last that long. Take September, 11, for example. The people of the United States stood together for a while, but after a few months went by things returned to their apathetic ways.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:56PM
Priest_Revan at 5:07PM, Jan. 21, 2007
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There would probably be 2 kinds of humans at that point:

1. The humans who will join in with others to fight the common enemy and possibly win.
2. Those who just join in with the chaos and destruction.

I dont' think the countries of the world to agree. Our kind is too stupid and arrogant and join together.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 2:47PM
Defilia at 11:35PM, Jan. 21, 2007
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i think it would be possible, it would however requie an enemy far greater than we have seen so far. if humans are confronted with a grave situation we will try to adabt, one way of adabting would be to unite.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:10PM
Phantom Penguin at 5:54AM, Jan. 22, 2007
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Mankind won't unite to a union. We hate eachother to much. And even if several large governments did join, there would be others that would refuse to be in the union with others.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:42PM
LIZARD_B1TE at 4:01PM, Jan. 22, 2007
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Here's the way I see humanity uniting:

1. Several major countries unite in order to colonize the moon
2. Moon colonies going great, to the point where they can support themselves (this is distant future; lot's of technology)
3. People of Earth destroy themselves in Nuclear War
4. People of moon unite in a single government and spread across the universe

Of course, there is no “common enemy” here. But there is a common good!
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:36PM
Priest_Revan at 6:37PM, Jan. 22, 2007
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Mankind won't unite to a union. We hate eachother to much. And even if several large governments did join, there would be others that would refuse to be in the union with others.

Hopefully, the ones who did join together would be enough to hold back the said “enemy”.

The other ones… they would die.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 2:47PM
mlai at 10:47AM, Jan. 23, 2007
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Humans would only unite against aliens if said aliens act like all Homo Sapiens is united against them.

If aliens do a minimum of research, and play human factions against one another, Earth would happily destroy itself for the aliens.

This is the fact of human history. Aborigine tribes/nations happily destroy each other, each courting the alliance of the new foreign power (be it Rome, Spain, or whoever).

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last edited on July 14, 2011 2:05PM
Defilia at 2:41PM, Jan. 23, 2007
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mlai
Humans would only unite against aliens if said aliens act like all Homo Sapiens is united against them.

If aliens do a minimum of research, and play human factions against one another, Earth would happily destroy itself for the aliens.

This is the fact of human history. Aborigine tribes/nations happily destroy each other, each courting the alliance of the new foreign power (be it Rome, Spain, or whoever).

i do see your point here.

i do however think that humanity COULD unite, not that anyone would as it stands now, and to be honest i think we would either need to get rid of religion, or learn to accepr our differences (we are having a hard time doing the last, and we allways have.)
Defilia is not to be used unless recomended by your psychologist.

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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:10PM
ccs1989 at 3:40PM, Jan. 23, 2007
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I think if the common enemy is strong enough and is pressuring humanity enough to have to unite, it could happen. However if the fight against this common enemy did not last several generations, we would just return to our normal ways once the enemy was vanquished.

The idea of a common enemy is an interesting one, as it's brought up in lots of literature such as Watchmen and Ender's Game. But the moral of each story is that the threat always constantly must linger on the horizon, or people become apathetic and turn their attentions to more immediate concerns and enemies.

But if people are afraid, they're willing to do anything.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:38AM
Mazoo at 4:26PM, Jan. 23, 2007
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ccs1989
But if people are afraid, they're willing to do anything.

Unification based on fear will not last long, though. Ultimately there will be those that become desparate or too scared and may try and join forces with this “common enemy.” There will always be those coniving folks that try to milk the system or situation in their favor as much as possible. With as much corruption as the world as already, that will definitely seep into the cause of fighting this great enemy. Especially if this enemy is extremely smart and offers those in power temptations in money, power and fame.

last edited on July 14, 2011 1:56PM
Aussie_kid at 5:45AM, Jan. 24, 2007
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To quote one of my favourite books ‘In fact the only times humans seemed to agree on anything was when they killing each other’ which I have seen to be very true. Here is my view on situations with a common enemy



The United Kingdom, United States, Australia and many others banded together in WW2. In the same time, nazi Germany and Italy agreed when it came to the deaths of all the people in the concentration camps.

Also, democracy vs communism. During the Cold War, there was the acceptance of other races, women and human rights in the western world. Why? My theory is their common enemy, communists. They had no need to fight each other

Console fanboys all agreed Jack Thompson was an asshole in 2005

In one of my comics (Which I have been waiting to get off the ground for over a year now) there was a scientist who proposed intelligent humans were a different species to any one below a 120 IQ. It lead to a war between the intelligent and the stupid and we can all guess who won. But the thing is, every one on either side was united, no matter their differences.

Also, Cowboys and Aliens. The European Settlers and Native Americans banded together to destroy the aliens, despite the problems between both races.



Be it fiction or life, we do tend to unite when we have a common enemy. Not all of us go along, but the majority of us do
Insanity Complex: We may not be insane, but we like to think we are
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:11AM
kyupol at 6:14AM, Jan. 25, 2007
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I think there is a stronger chance of human unity.

Unity is only achieved through common interests.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 1:25PM
ccs1989 at 6:23PM, Jan. 26, 2007
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Mazoo
ccs1989
But if people are afraid, they're willing to do anything.

Unification based on fear will not last long, though. Ultimately there will be those that become desparate or too scared and may try and join forces with this “common enemy.” There will always be those coniving folks that try to milk the system or situation in their favor as much as possible. With as much corruption as the world as already, that will definitely seep into the cause of fighting this great enemy. Especially if this enemy is extremely smart and offers those in power temptations in money, power and fame.



That's why the common enemy would need to be some kind of threat offworld or something like that, that humans couldn't contact, but would get attacked by every week or so just to keep fear up. The key thing is the fear has to be constant, and communication between sides can't occur.
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“If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours.”
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:38AM
Mark at 9:43AM, Jan. 27, 2007
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I think humanity could easily unite against a common enemy if it were strong enough, however, it'd be only temporary cause once the problem is solved, for better or worse, It'd be back to normal
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:54PM
theleast at 12:33AM, Jan. 31, 2007
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No matter how grace the threat, there would never be a universal consensus on how best to proceed. Even if the vast majority of mankind were to unite against a particular threat, it would only be sustained for as long as the threat remained (or at least as long as the perception of threat remained).

Look at the present example: The entire population of Earth is faced with global warming as a universal threat, but no-one can agree on what to do about it and many still refuse to admit that the danger exists.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:20PM
ozoneocean at 3:03AM, Jan. 31, 2007
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I think most people have the right idea here: Unity in the face of the threat, but not outside of that.
WW2 is a good example. The US, USSR, the UK, France, China, and a lot of other otherwise unlikely enemies were united against common foes for a while.
…As Aussie Kid said! :)

It helps to have someone acknowledged as a “leader” though. That's why I would say that the US is no longer a “super” power and is now merely a very powerful country: The difference is that back during the Cold War countries like the USA and USSR were acknowledged leaders of all other countries in their political blocks, they could call not just on their own resources, but everyone else's as well. That's simply no longer possible… Any call-to-arms involves much more negotiation, supplication, and compromise, and if that fails, so does the endeavour.

But whatever, yes humanity could unite to face off a clearly designated threat such as aliens. Things like Global warming and asteroids from outer space are different… They're ill defined, possible, eventual: It is perceived that Climate Change involves almost as much sacrifice to fight it as to endure it. Ideas like that tend to muddy the waters quite a bit.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:25PM
vgman at 5:48AM, Jan. 31, 2007
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i dont know id like to think that the only reason mankind fights itself is because they dont have a common enemy or somthing to keep them occupied. if they did AND it was a large enugh threat i belive we would unite and kick ass and once the threat is gone we can fight over the spoils of war (ahh the great circle)
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last edited on July 14, 2011 4:40PM
kyupol at 3:23PM, Jan. 31, 2007
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I'd still think though that humans will still continue to fight each other.

In the game Starcraft, even with protoss and zerg as threats, the terrans (humans) still had politics and fought against each other. Notice most terran campaigns are fighting against other terran?

yeah yeah… you'd give me the “its just a stupid game” card.

But thats what is still likely to happen if humanity was threatened by aliens. Maybe the aliens will befriend some humans and make em fight each other. Do the divide and conquer strategy.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 1:25PM
Priceman at 10:32AM, Feb. 1, 2007
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The logical thing to do would be to unite. “The enemy of my enemy is my friend” or so they say. Unfortunately, humanity is rarely logical when it comes things on a wide scale.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:47PM
vgman at 6:23PM, Feb. 3, 2007
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I'd still think though that humans will still continue to fight each other.

In the game Starcraft, even with protoss and zerg as threats, the terrans (humans) still had politics and fought against each other. Notice most terran campaigns are fighting against other terran?

yeah yeah… you'd give me the “its just a stupid game” card.

But thats what is still likely to happen if humanity was threatened by aliens. Maybe the aliens will befriend some humans and make em fight each other. Do the divide and conquer strategy.

That was a pretty fun game and i do have to say you have a point but in that game the protoss and zerg where not that big of a threat to the human race seeing as the zerg and protoss where usually fighting each other the real villan in that game is the zerg in any case as the protoss and terran eventually team up in any case. so if the threat is minimal then why should we go all out agginst them. besides the zerg was a product of terran bio-enginearing any way
RIP TD :cry2:
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:40PM
suzi at 8:51AM, Feb. 7, 2007
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There is a well established principle in the social sciences which
states that whenever the cooperation of two people is enlisted towards
the completion of some task that is of equivalent importance to both
(and which cannot be successfully completed except through the close cooperative
enterprise of the two people
), those two people will come to like each other,
they will become friends, and their values, attitudes, goals, etc., will
tend to become increasingly similar. This is known as the principle of the
superordinate goal
.

from http://www.love-shy.com/Gilmartin/Chapter11/Principleofthesuper.html

Also, http://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/DPF.CHAP21.HTM is an incredibly in-depth study of the superordinate goal, and it looks like it's being used ultimately to refer to “UNDERSTANDING CONFLICT AND WAR”

It's science, kids!

last edited on July 14, 2011 4:05PM
ozoneocean at 9:29AM, Feb. 7, 2007
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suzi
those two people will come to like each other, they will become friends, and their values, attitudes, goals, etc., will tend to become increasingly similar.
So why didn't the USSR and USA stay friends after WW2? :)
I'd say that this "Principle of the superordinate goal“ also has counter principals working against it… The ”Principal of self interest“? The ”Principal of every man for himself“? What about: ”Screw you mate, I'll take what I can get while I can get it!" ;)

I dunno, just a theory.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:25PM
7384395948urhfdjfrueruieieueue at 3:28PM, Feb. 10, 2007
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I think we would. Everyone for some reason likes to act like everyone is ignorant and mankind is so self-destructive, but when you look at the stats, prejudice has been dropping for a while now. True, some events can bring it back. After 9/11 many Americans were paranoid of Arabs, but I think if we were all in a life-threatening situation we'd at least be smart enough to put that nonsense behind us.

But seriously, what is with all of you insulting you're own species? The way you say it bothers me, it's almost as if you're acting like you're the only intelligent humans left. Sure, mankind can be irrational, but you'd be dead wrong if you said we were illogical. Our species is the most intelligent on Earth, so much so we practically control it. This is our world and I doubt we'd let hate for each other destroy it.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:03AM
ccs1989 at 11:31AM, Feb. 11, 2007
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Problem is every human has differing views, and so there are many different perspectives on what “illogical” thinking IS.
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“If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours.”
-Henry David Thoreau, Walden
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:38AM
LilyRose at 7:08PM, Feb. 16, 2007
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Atom Apple
I think we would. Everyone for some reason likes to act like everyone is ignorant and mankind is so self-destructive, but when you look at the stats, prejudice has been dropping for a while now.


What “prejudice” are you talking about, I wonder, that has been dropping for a while now. Can't be almost a million men women and children slaughtered in Rwanda because they were from the wrong tribe, now, eh?

Can't be Croat Ethnic Cleansing of Serbs based on hatred of who they are as a group, or Serbian “rape camps” with the goal of invading the Croat gene pool to destroy their people, right?

Can't be the genocide and bloodlust of Moslems versus Christians in Sierra Leone, now, can it?

Gotta widen your sights, if you're talking about humans. How many have died or been brutalized in just the past 10 years based on prejudice more than anything else? Slaughter has never been more fashionable as it is right now.


But seriously, what is with all of you insulting you're own species? The way you say it bothers me, it's almost as if you're acting like you're the only intelligent humans left. Sure, mankind can be irrational, but you'd be dead wrong if you said we were illogical. Our species is the most intelligent on Earth, so much so we practically control it. This is our world and I doubt we'd let hate for each other destroy it.



We “control” the Earth? That's a fascinating concept; that we “control” a planet. Can we affect its rotation? Speed the year along to get winter over with faster? Can we manipulate global weather?


I submit, that when you say the we as a species “control” the Earth, that all you're really talking about is our destructive capabilities. We have the ability to run out of town, or to eradicate, any natural population of any part of the planet, and we have the ability to strip the environment of every useful living and mineral thing residing there.

We can kill. We can destroy. We can build art5icifical structures that sit on top of the planet, but what is it we really have control over?

Other humans I think. We can control each other. WE can force things into submission. Is this kind of control an indication of us being the smartest species that ever was?

I dunno, I don't think so.

As for not being illogical… well… I would say that the massive environmental degradation being done is certainly illogical, since it will lead to the eventual destruction of - not the planet, mind you - but of our species. It is logical to act so that the species will survive. It is illogical to act in a selfish manner so that you leave nothing for future generations.

Oh - humans are an illogical bunch alright
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:35PM
7384395948urhfdjfrueruieieueue at 3:15PM, Feb. 18, 2007
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We are talking about one big enemy and the countries you listed would barely help in a war that big. All of the countries that wanted to change have. Those are the only important ones because only the big important ones are intelligent enough to change. Try this. Compare KKK members now to when it was founded.

Those other countries aren't our problem. We've all seen what happens when we try to help them.

Now, for the environmental thing you brought up, do you realize there are more plants in this country then there were when it was first founded?
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:03AM

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