Debate and Discussion

Why I would vote for Barack Obama
Fuzzy Modem at 5:10PM, Dec. 8, 2007
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-given the opportunity.

I turned 18 in 1998. The first election I could vote in was Gore vs Bush. I didn't vote.

I've regretted that decision ever since. See, because I didn't vote, I didn't feel like I have the right to bitch, and I had a lot of stuff I wanted to bitch about.

The next election I could vote in was Kerry vs Bush. This time I was sure to vote. I didn't particularly like Kerry. I always felt like he was pandering to me.
Disingenuous. That's the word, but you know, better than the alternative and all. I was shocked when Bush won again. I've been bitching aloud ever since :p

I've spent a lot of time reading about Barack Obama recently. I gotta tell you this guy is the first person I've even been excited to vote for. I really can't wait.

I listen to him speak, and I don't see a politician. I see a scrawny kid on a beach in Hawaii, looking toward the sunset and considering the possibilities.

That's the American dream folks. We're a nation of optimists. From all over the world came the most tenacious of the human race. The ones willing to take on an adventure on the hopes of a fresh start. A new continent where we could start the next renaissance. We believed we could do it, against all odds, and we were right.

You know, a lot of people say that other countries hate us right now. I don't think that's true. The world sees America as a wild card. We've got the potential for such greatness, they're disappointed when we squander it.

What makes America romantic is the notion that anyone can reach for a dream and have a shot. That's what defines us. In practice as well as concept. It's where our sense of national pride comes from.

America has become a giant machine of immense power that is driving the course of history. The president is the man at the wheel, then man who says ‘yes’ or ‘no’ to that power. His answer's should correspond to the general will of the populace he represents. To me, that's the president.

An American president clipped coupons.
An American president balanced a checkbook.
An American president didn't always fill his gas tank all the way.
An American president's insurance didn't cover a trip to the emergency room.
An American president has said goodbye to friends as they went off to war.
An American president knows what a gallon of milk costs for ****s sake.

For the first time in a long time, I am proud to be an American, and I'll be proud to vote for Obama.

'Nuff said.


I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM
bobhhh at 7:11PM, Dec. 8, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
-given the opportunity.

I turned 18 in 1998. The first election I could vote in was Gore vs Bush. I didn't vote.

I've regretted that decision ever since. See, because I didn't vote, I didn't feel like I have the right to bitch, and I had a lot of stuff I wanted to bitch about. Some of you probably remember :p

The next election I could vote in was Kerry vs Bush. This time I was sure to vote. I didn't particularly like Kerry. I always felt like he was pandering to me.
Disingenuous. That's the word, but you know, better than the alternative and all. I was shocked when Bush won again. I've been bitching aloud ever since :p

I've spent a lot of time reading about Barack Obama recently. I gotta tell you this guy is the first person I've even been excited to vote for. I really can't wait.

I listen to him speak, and I don't see a politician. I see a scrawny kid on a beach in Hawaii, looking toward the sunset and considering the possibilities.

That's the American dream folks. We're a nation of optimists. From all over the world came the most tenacious of the human race. The ones willing to take on an adventure on the hopes of a fresh start. A new continent where we could start the next renaissance. We believed we could do it, against all odds, and we were right.

You know, a lot of people say that other countries hate us right now. I don't think that's true. The world sees America as a wild card. We've got the potential for such greatness, they're disappointed when we squander it.

What makes America romantic is the notion that anyone can reach for a dream and have a shot. That's what defines us. In practice as well as concept. It's where our sense of national pride comes from.

America has become a giant machine of immense power that is driving the course of history. The president is the man at the wheel, then man who says ‘yes’ or ‘no’ to that power. His answer's should correspond to the general will of the populace he represents. To me, that's the president.

An American president clipped coupons.
An American president balanced a checkbook.
An American president didn't always fill his gas tank all the way.
An American president's insurance didn't cover a trip to the emergency room.
An American president has said goodbye to friends as they went off to war.
An American president knows what a gallon of milk costs for ****s sake.

For the first time in a long time, I am proud to be an American, and I'll be proud to vote for Obama.

'Nuff said.

Nice. Very moving. Prepare for the onlsaught of the pessimists. Lots of people will want to take issue with your optimism.

Don't let them.
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
lothar at 7:27PM, Dec. 8, 2007
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NO ! i will not vote for anybody who supports Ethanol use !!!!
Ethanol is the single most important issue in this election and any election going on on the planet now . Why doe nobody realize this ?
you have an increasing world population , diminishing land for farming , People are starving , Thousands of people CHILDREN die everyday from starvation , global grain stocks are at their lowest point in 25 years and shrinking fast !
And these Idiots want to turn the food into inefficient fuel for cars !!!
Ethanol and bio-deisle destroy the environment accelerating climate change, they creat massive plantations worked by slaves !!

Ethanol = Genocide !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No to Obama or any other candidate , they all support government subsidies to convert more of our food to feed the 800 million metal monsters we have created
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
Nyx at 8:25PM, Dec. 8, 2007
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Eh. There's always going to be starvation. More food just means more population. If we feed all the starving people and nobody dies hungry the next even larger generation will go hungry still. There's only so much food that can be produced. Lack of food is a symptom of overpopulation.
-edit- Nevermind that question since you answered it in your other thread. If the other reasons are true then yes I'll agree with you on Ethanol not being worth it. No use to make even more people starve because of it.

And now I'll get back on topic. I think Obama is a decent candidate. I like Joe Biden better but there doesn't seem like any feasible chance of him winning. I'll need to look into the candidates more before I make a final choice.
It's been awhile since I heard someone being this genuinely patriotic. I'll have to disagree with you on how others feel about America though. If I was in their perspective I'd think we were a bunch of loonies. 'Specially since Bush was re-elected. Seriously. WHY!? (Oh if only Gore won… ;_; )
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:19PM
Fuzzy Modem at 10:08PM, Dec. 8, 2007
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lothar
No to Obama or any other candidate, they all support government subsidies

So your advice is… vote for no one. So… just leave Bush in office then? I don't suppose he'd object…


I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM
lothar at 12:10AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
lothar
No to Obama or any other candidate, they all support government subsidies

So your advice is… vote for no one. So… just leave Bush in office then? I don't suppose he'd object…

you took what i said and removed the most important stuff !!! it's the ETHANOL !!! the “bio”fuel !
no matter , that's a different subject
Dems and Reps are all the same realy ! their all corporate dogs .
if i were in the states i would vote for that one guy , the guy that started the Impeachment proceedings against cheney , i forgot his name , starts with a K
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
TnTComic at 6:53AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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lothar
NO ! i will not vote for anybody who supports Ethanol use !!!!
Ethanol is the single most important issue in this election and any election going on on the planet now . Why doe nobody realize this ?

Because you're wrong.

I'll vote for Obama because he's not a typical politician. He seems inexperienced and optimistic, 2 things that could be very refreshing in the white house.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:31PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 8:02AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
An American president clipped coupons.
An American president balanced a checkbook.
An American president didn't always fill his gas tank all the way.
An American president's insurance didn't cover a trip to the emergency room.
An American president has said goodbye to friends as they went off to war.
An American president knows what a gallon of milk costs for ****s sake.

Wow, that's a strange set of reasons to chose a president. I suppose it's better than chosing one based on how good their hair looks but hey, each to his own.

If you are using those critera to chose a president, then what about this guy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul

Ron Paul was born in Green Tree, Pennsylvania, to Margaret Paul and Howard Caspar Paul, son of a German immigrant. Paul was the third of five sons born during seven years in the Great Depression, and shared one bedroom of their four-room house with brothers William (the oldest), David, Jerrold, and Wayne. Paul began working at Harold's dairy at age five, and later delivered newspapers, worked in a drugstore, and became a milkman on reaching driving age.

He paid for his first year at Gettysburg College with saved newspaper-delivery, lemonade-sale, and lawn-mowing money. He delivered mail and laundry in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania; managed the college coffee shop one year; and joined the swim team. Inducted into the Lambda Chi Alpha fraternity, he served as pledge class president, house manager, and kitchen steward, planning and supervising cooks for all meals. He received his bachelor's in 1957, majoring in biology.

Paul considered becoming a Lutheran minister like two of his brothers. Instead he decided to pursue a medical doctorate at Duke University School of Medicine, attaining it in 1961. He interned and began residency training, both in internal medicine, at Henry Ford Hospital in Detroit.

The training was soon interrupted when he was drafted into the U.S. Air Force during the Cuban Missile Crisis. He remained in the military during the early years of the Vietnam War. He served active duty as a flight surgeon from 1963 to 1965, attending to the ear, nose, and throat problems of pilots in South Korea, Iran, Ethiopia, and Turkey, but was never sent to Vietnam. Based out of Kelly Air Force Base in San Antonio, Paul achieved the rank of captain and obtained his private pilot's license

Assuming the practice of a retiring doctor in Lake Jackson, Texas, in a single day, Paul became the only ob/gyn doctor in Brazoria County, reportedly delivering 40–50 babies a month and frequently busy with surgery. His practice refused Medicare and Medicaid payments; he worked pro bono, arranged discounted or custom-payment plans for needy patients, or otherwise “just took care of them.”

I suspect he or his wife clipped coupons at some point.

He ran a medical practice so I'd guess he balanced a checkbook.

Born during the Great Depresion I suspect he didn't always have a gas tank to fill all the way.

Since he was a doctor I suppose he didn't worry about insurance not covering a trip to the emergency room, except that he was the only doctor in town so I suppose he'd have to explain to his nurse how to do the surgery to save his life.

He not only said goodbye to friends as they went off to war but he fixed them up so they could go to war.

Not only does he know what a gallon of milk costs he knows where it comes from and how it gets to your house.

He also didn't vote for the War or the unbalanced budget that is paying for the war. Can Obama a say that?

Seems that Ron Paul meets and exceeds your criteria. Will you throw your support behind him or are you just a shill for the Obama campaign trying to drum up support so he can beat Clinton in the primary?

My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM
lothar at 8:29AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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TnTComic
lothar
NO ! i will not vote for anybody who supports Ethanol use !!!!
Ethanol is the single most important issue in this election and any election going on on the planet now . Why doe nobody realize this ?

Because you're wrong.

I'll vote for Obama because he's not a typical politician. He seems inexperienced and optimistic, 2 things that could be very refreshing in the white house.

“inexperienced and optimistic” sounds like he doesn't know wtf is going on , anybody who is optimistic is not paying attention !!! we are entering the collapse of civillization here.
anyway, i don't need to argue with you people , you'll all see in a few years when you're slaving away to grow switchgrass for the killbots
it doesn't matter who wins, we all lose
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:45PM
TnTComic at 9:46AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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lothar
“inexperienced and optimistic” sounds like he doesn't know wtf is going on , anybody who is optimistic is not paying attention !!!

Do you know how much experience Rumsfeld has? Did that help?

lothar
we are entering the collapse of civillization here.
anyway, i don't need to argue with you people , you'll all see in a few years when you're slaving away to grow switchgrass for the killbots
it doesn't matter who wins, we all lose

Yeah… have fun out there, Lothar.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:31PM
THE D_KING at 9:57AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Someone
man this suck's
am the king in the shadow's.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:14PM
Fuzzy Modem at 11:56AM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Obama never supported the war.

I like Ron Paul. I like his stance on legalization of drugs via states rights. I think he would make a good president. I just think Obama would make an amazing president.


I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 4:57PM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
Obama never supported the war

Got a source for that? Voting records or anything else like that?
My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM
Fuzzy Modem at 5:15PM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Mister Mxyzptlk
Got a source for that? Voting records or anything else like that?

Uh yeah. It isn't exactly contested. He's (on the record atleast) never supported the war. Are you that surprised?

Barack Obama
I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda. I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama#_note-107


I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM
bobhhh at 7:10PM, Dec. 9, 2007
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Barack Obama
I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda. I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars.

I like that guy more and more. I also like Ron Paul. It's nice to hear some unrehearsed truth for a change instead of downloadable partisan talking points.
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
freefall_drift at 2:04PM, Dec. 10, 2007
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I'm for Edwards/Obama or Obama/Edwards.
Freefall Drift - A sci fi space opera of a starship's mission of stopping the Endless Kings.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:31PM
dueeast at 5:50PM, Dec. 10, 2007
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This is the first election in my memory (and I'm 38) where I can't stand any of the candidates on any side. *sighs*
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:17PM
horseboy at 7:07PM, Dec. 10, 2007
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I can certainly see the draw of Obama. He reminds me of my cousin, and has a very Mr. Smith Goes to Washington kinda feel.
The downsides out weigh it for me, however. I just don't want to suffer the tax burden to pay for all those programs he's promising. And he apparently doesn't respect the Constitution and it's limits for government's power. But man he's got Charisma.
There is no such word as “alot”. “A lot” is two words.
Voltaire
Never seek for happiness, it will merely allude the seeker. Never strive for knowledge, it is beyond man's scope. Never think, for in though lies all the ills of mankind. The wise man, like the rat, the crocodile, the fly, merely fulfills his natural function.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:50PM
bobhhh at 8:43PM, Dec. 10, 2007
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horseboy
I can certainly see the draw of Obama. He reminds me of my cousin, and has a very Mr. Smith Goes to Washington kinda feel.
The downsides out weigh it for me, however. I just don't want to suffer the tax burden to pay for all those programs he's promising. And he apparently doesn't respect the Constitution and it's limits for government's power. But man he's got Charisma.

That's an old myth that social programs will break the bank. If you are poor you won't suffer that bad, and if you're rich, well….you're rich!!

The majority of the money handed out in welfare goes to major corporations in straight handouts and tax breaks. Then there's the military.

Social programs are relatively low percentage of GNP and when handled correctly can actually increase the tax base by acting as a safety net and lifting people out of poverty so they can get back on the tax roll.

One example is Public School. Some failures notwithstanding, on the whole our society is better off for having taxes collected to educate the public.

Taxes and social programs are ok if they are managed well and produce results. You only hear rich people bellyaching about high taxes and money being wasted on social programs, because poor people pay way less a percentage of their income, that is of course unless the rich people continue to firgure out how to cheat the spirit of the code and hide their income.

If Barack Obama wants to restructure the tax code so people making more than 300-400 thousand bucks a year pay more taxes to fund his programs, I'm all for it. Rich people need to remember that living in America and reaping the benefits of capitalism is a privelige as much as it is a birth right.

My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
usedbooks at 1:24AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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The problem with presidential candidates is that every one of them is a politician.

I like Ron Paul, but I can't vote in Republican primaries. If he makes it to the general ballot, I'd definitely consider voting for him, depending on who the Democrat is and how the campaigns run after primaries. Issues are debated so radically differently when going against another party than they are within one's own party. (Going back to my original point that the problem is they are all politicians…)

I would love to see a president that doesn't make the whole country look bad, but I think that is too much to expect out of any candidate.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:37PM
n_y_japlander at 1:37AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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Let's all take a journey in to the past…. *insert Twilight Zone music here*

In 1987 (later in the year) I pre-registered to vote in the 1988 election!!! Proud 18 year old, wanting to do his thing for his country….

When the day came, I went to the voting center, and the big bald stinky guy said “Well son, I see you have a card, but you are not in my computer list thingie…” (yes this is what he said) “if you are not in this computer list thingie, you must not exsit!”

So I went all the way to Tallahassee to protest and to find out how to clear up the mess…. They said about the same thing. So, I am very much alive when it comes to paying taxes (I have not done so legally for 9 years, but) I exsist, but to vote… that is an other story!

So, I have never voted, and I never will!

last edited on July 14, 2011 2:19PM
bobhhh at 1:48AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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n_y_japlander
Let's all take a journey in to the past…. *insert Twilight Zone music here*

In 1987 (later in the year) I pre-registered to vote in the 1988 election!!! Proud 18 year old, wanting to do his thing for his country….

When the day came, I went to the voting center, and the big bald stinky guy said “Well son, I see you have a card, but you are not in my computer list thingie…” (yes this is what he said) “if you are not in this computer list thingie, you must not exsit!”

So I went all the way to Tallahassee to protest and to find out how to clear up the mess…. They said about the same thing. So, I am very much alive when it comes to paying taxes (I have not done so legally for 9 years, but) I exsist, but to vote… that is an other story!

So, I have never voted, and I never will!

voting is important enough to get over your anger and solve the problem.
My name is Bob and I approved this signature.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:29AM
n_y_japlander at 2:01AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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bobhhh
voting is important enough to get over your anger and solve the problem.

Yes I agree…. do you have some time I can borrow?
I would have to go to Tallahassee to do the whole process all over again. I live in Tokyo, Japan now, no part of DoD or government, a cilvilian. So, I would have to go to the capital city of the last state I was registered as a citzen. SO, as important as voting is, the process will take a few days (I called and asked), and the time and money it would take to resolve this problem just does not add up to any benifits…
But, I do agree with you!

last edited on July 14, 2011 2:19PM
TnTComic at 4:09AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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dueeast
This is the first election in my memory (and I'm 38) where I can't stand any of the candidates on any side. *sighs*

Biden is the man.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:31PM
imshard at 10:56AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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I'm going with huckabee (not really, I'm still looking)
for the simple reason that he is:

Don't be a stick in the mud traditionalist! Support global warming!

Tech Support: The Comic!! Updates Somedays!!
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:58PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 11:44AM, Dec. 11, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
He's (on the record at least) never supported the war.

Sure, he may have said that. How has he VOTED?

I could go look it up myself but I'm lazy and wouldn't vote for a Democrat if my life depended on it.
My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM
TnTComic at 12:00PM, Dec. 11, 2007
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nert nert nert
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:31PM
Fuzzy Modem at 12:08PM, Dec. 11, 2007
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Mister Mxyzptlk
Fuzzy Modem
He's (on the record at least) never supported the war.

Sure, he may have said that. How has he VOTED?

I could go look it up myself but I'm lazy and wouldn't vote for a Democrat if my life depended on it.

People vote “on the record”, and yes, you are lazy. Why vote at all? Just put down (R) for the rest of your life, and then act all surprised when Hitler II takes the throne by putting (R) behind his name.

Because limiting your options to one choice makes things easier doesn't it. It would suck to have to think about anything, right?

Or you could vote for a PERSON. Just a thought.



I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM
Mister Mxyzptlk at 12:41PM, Dec. 11, 2007
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Fuzzy Modem
People vote “on the record”,

Yes. Do you have that voting record handy? Can you post a link to the votes where Obama voted against the “broad open declaration of beating the crap out of whomever Bush wanted to” resolution that the Senate voted on? I haven't heard much about Obama's record on that in the news, I figured a big time Obama guy like yourself would have that link all ready to go.

Fuzzy Modem
Why vote at all?

I don't. I'm here on a fifth dimensional visa like I've said before.

Fuzzy Modem
Just put down (R) for the rest of your life, and then act all surprised when Hitler II takes the throne by putting (R) behind his name.

Two points.

First, I wouldn't vote for a Republican either. Fifth dimensional citizen again…

Second, Hitler? Come on. Hitler was a liberal. A national socialist. Anti smoker, anti gun, anti religious… Come on. If you're going to accuse Republicans of something horrible at least get the references right.

Fuzzy Modem
Or you could vote for a PERSON. Just a thought.

Well, I did vote for myself on the Fifth Dimensional Mayoral ballot… But Big Blue screwed me out of that race. Curse him!
My soul was removed to make room for all this sarcasm.
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:04PM
Fuzzy Modem at 12:49PM, Dec. 11, 2007
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I've stopped thinking liberal vs conservative, dem vs rep, blue vs red. F*ck the party system. Another reason I'm hoping for Obama. He agrees that the party system is pointless.


I've given up following my dreams. I just asked where they're going and I'm gonna meet them there.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:32PM

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