Drunk Duck Awards

2014 Discussion
irrevenant at 1:28PM, Jan. 19, 2014
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Aw, sorry I missed the cut off. I had trouble coming up with what to draw for it.
Niccea at 5:22PM, Jan. 19, 2014
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The cut off isn't until 24th you have a whole week
bravo1102 at 10:44AM, Jan. 20, 2014
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Unless there is a flood of new photocomics from creators other than myself, after looking at the list of nominees, I think it's time to ditch the best photo comic category.  It sort of stands out in only having four nominees (any others were probably for discontinued comics?)

As far as I can tell from the weak site search function there are only three currently updating photocomics.   Doesn't really deserve its own category anymore.
El Cid at 1:38PM, Jan. 20, 2014
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I guess that makes sense; photocomics can still fall under the Best Use of Medium category. Arguably, Best 3D and Best Pixel/Sprite could fit in there too.
irrevenant at 6:26PM, Jan. 20, 2014
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Like Bravo said, that seems like the sort of call best made closer to the date.  It's only very early 2014 and we could have more contenders in the category by then. If we don't, I tend to agree that it can be subsumed into other categories where appropriate.

What exactly is the ‘Best use of medium’ category about? I always figured it was more about telling a story (or whatever) in a way that utilises the possibilities of the comics medium, rather than about the specific process or technology used to create the comic. For example, a comic that illustrates time travel by having a character pass something to himself in an earlier panel, or use of windows in a building to serve as story panels could only be done in the comic medium. It wouldn't have to be gimmicky though - simply using the unique combination of consecutive pictures and (optionally) words in an effective way would count. 

Currently I would say that 3D has more than enough nominees of high quality to merit its own category.  But like photocomics, that would really have to be evaluated closer to the date.  

(I don't currently read any DD sprite comics so I can't comment there, but presumably the same applies). 
last edited on Jan. 20, 2014 6:37PM
irrevenant at 6:35PM, Jan. 20, 2014
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Is that Fan Art specifically of the DD Awards, BTW?  (Yes, I'm still trying to come up with something. -_-). 
El Cid wrote:
The Extras are basically just silly sketches we throw in along with the rest of the awards show to keep things fun. It can be anything, really: Fan art, a short comic strip, a little mini story, a concession speech, fake advertisements, conspiracy theories, gossip, you name it. As long as it's not something mean about other DD people. I've always felt like the extras and behind-the-scenes are the best part of the awards, but we never seem to get very many submissions (I guess because the people most likely to do them are already busy judging and doing presentations).
 
If you can come up with anything, just go ahead and send it in to Niccea before the deadline (Jan 24th, I believe).
El Cid at 5:16AM, Jan. 21, 2014
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I guess it doesn't have to be, but DD Awards-themed artwork would go over better with the readers, given the venue. But it could be something happening before or after the awards, or like a promotional poster, that type of thing. Or just whatever comes to mind. It doesn't really *need* to be anything, specifically.
bravo1102 at 7:11AM, Jan. 21, 2014
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irrevenant wrote:
What exactly is the ‘Best use of medium’ category about? I always figured it was more about telling a story (or whatever) in a way that utilises the possibilities of the comics medium, rather than about the specific process or technology used to create the comic. 
 You're confusing layout and medium.  Medium is what an artist uses to create the images from watercolor to photography.  Go to an art museum and the tag says medium: oils  not “swirling colors to indicate motion through the eyes of the painter on a journey through time”
 

Plot development, layout, backgrounds and action are the elements that you're describing and they are judged seperately.  There were once awards for best use of color and Black and white but  too few specific nominees so it got lumped into medium.  We have trouble judging what there is and should be looking to streamline the awards. 

And also any way to preclude any further involvement in the awards by bravo1102.  Yeah I know you're out there…
last edited on Jan. 21, 2014 7:14AM
irrevenant at 3:51PM, Jan. 21, 2014
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LoL, even when I'm basically just agreeing with people, it gets contentious! xD

I totally agree that medium is what an artist uses to create art (it doesn't even need to be images - printed text is a medium too, for example). Watercolour and pastels are examples of separate mediums. And medium is definitely a different thing to layouts and techniques.

Where the confusion comes in is that comics - ie. a progression of images with optional words - has itself come to be considered a medium.  This has probably been popularised by Scott McCloud's “Understanding Comics”. Wikipedia's first words on comics are "Comics is a visual medium used to “.

So when I read ”Best use of medium“ I immediately think best use of the MEDIUM OF COMICS, not best use of whatever medium was used within that medium (awkward, isn't it? :/). 

Layout, etc. come under the ”Best use of" side of the equation. IMO, the best use of watercolours is to skillfully utilise the transparency and flowing interaction of paints that is unique to the watercolour medium. And the best use of the comics medium is to skillfully utilise techniques that are only possible using comics, ie sequential images. 

I suspect it's debatable whether the term ‘medium’ should legitimately be applied to comics (or for that matter television which is roughly analogous), but the simple fact is: the term *is* widely used that way and if you use a narrower definition of the term in the context of discussing comics then there will be confusion. 
Niccea at 4:20PM, Jan. 21, 2014
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RE: Best use of Medium
 
All this is hense the definition next to the category.
**Best Use of Medium: Whether the comic is in black and white or full color, the author does a good job at using it.
 
 
Re: Photo Comics
 
Photo Comics were on the low edge of voting last year as well. Other comics were on the chopping block ahead of it.
last edited on Jan. 21, 2014 4:26PM
irrevenant at 5:20PM, Jan. 21, 2014
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So my initial interpretation was correct then - the title refers to the medium of comics rather than the medium used *by* the comic? Any chance of renaming the category “Best use of the comics medium” or “Best use of comics as a medium” or something to minimise confusion in future? 

Either way, that means that “Best use of medium” isn't the right place to put photo or sprite comics.

I still think 3D has the numbers to hold its own category but it *is* appealing to just have a simple “Best comic created through non-drawing techniques” (or just “Best non-drawn comic”) category that encompasses 3D comics, sprite comics, photo and screenshot comics as well as comics like Wondermark that assemble the comic from pre-existing art. (Dinosaur comics nears the border but, since it's the creator's original art that's being copy-pasted I personally wouldn't put it in this category). 

BTW, if someone created a comic using Second Life, would that count as a 3D/Poser comic or not?
Niccea at 5:59PM, Jan. 21, 2014
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No No. The opposite. We used to have best use of color or black and white. No good. Combined to medium. No matter what medium is used to create the comic, the winner of this one is the one where its medium is used the best. Therefore technically, photo and sprite comics would be eligible if their use of their component medium was a cut above the rest.
irrevenant at 9:03PM, Jan. 21, 2014
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Ah,  I see. Yeah, that's a good category and a very abstract concept to try to convey unambiguously. 

Do you think it might be worth abstracting it further and making it a general “best there is at what they do” award (to quote a certain comics character :))? 

It would make for kind of a fun category where you could let nominators specify what they're nominating a comic for. Everything from “Best Sprite Comic” to “Best use of the colour purple”. The only restriction would be that grounds for nomination would have to be kept PG.
last edited on Jan. 21, 2014 9:05PM
Niccea at 3:43PM, Jan. 22, 2014
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You just discribed the Create Your Own Award (502)
irrevenant at 1:44AM, Jan. 23, 2014
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D'oh!  Oh well, I guess that means you *liked* the idea at least.  :/

So, broader picture question:  What can be done to build up the size of the DD community in time for the next DD Awards?  'cos if that gets solved, a lot of the other problems go away on their own.
Niccea wrote:
You just discribed the Create Your Own Award (502)
El Cid at 5:13AM, Jan. 23, 2014
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Unfortunately, I think most of that is going to be up to the admins and whether this current reclamation project of theirs is successful. For starters, they need to fix the PQs, fix the comic browser, and fix the comics so that users have more control over their layouts and can run their own ads.
 
That last one's huge. One of the big reasons why there's been a steady drain on the site has been that Wowio, as a matter of policy, does not allow users here to run ads and earn revenue on their comics here. The result was as inevitable as it was obvious (and I believe I warned them about it years ago in their discussion thread). When the more talented artists figured out that they could earn revenue posting at other places, and they can't earn revenue posting here, all of the incentive is for them to leave. So eventually you're left with a site that doesn't have much quality content left, because anybody good enough to earn revenue from their work won't post here. Just stupid, short-sighted policy on the part of our Wowio overlords. Not at all surprised they're going bankrupt.
Reashi at 3:47PM, Jan. 23, 2014
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What it's sounding like as I read the whole thread is that (to come back to the original argument, but also include the smaller awards) in my opinion what it comes down to is a comics visibilty.
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The more popular comics are typically the ones that have been around longer, or have something that is eye catching. This in turn gets them the majority of the views, which in turn gets them more votes (usually.) As an example from my own library of past comics, and as has been brought up the top 20 comics: Back in the day of the DD site, I never could reach the top spots, but I managed to make it into the top of the adult category when there was one on the frontpage. (At the time I had an adult comic or two. However I used that as a gimick for the stories I wanted to tell.) This allowed my old comic at the time to get visibilty and a readership if at the least for some time. As for others the awards present some with visibility that they may not normally get. While I do agree that we should make this easier on Niccea and the others, I think as far as adult comics in mainstream awards go, it works as it is and probably shouldn't be tampered with.
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I brought up my story for the purpose of illustrating that sometimes even if a comic is about trying to tell a good story, it doesn't always manage to get seen as there are already people blocking that view withe their own popularity and grandfathered in status. Sometimes that adult edge is just that, an edge they needed to get some boosted views.
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It's not nice to say, it may not be the popular attitude, but I felt I needed to put in my two cents as a presenter and long time DD'er.
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TL'DR: If it ain't broke don't fix it, keep the adult comics where they are, don't tamper too much with the big awards. Little awards should be looked at as stated by others when the time comes again for awards.
last edited on Jan. 23, 2014 3:48PM
El Cid at 8:53AM, Jan. 24, 2014
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Just as an aside, I think it's a bad idea to shoehorn in “adult” elements into a story just because it might add visibility and readers. If it's something you honestly want to do, or it's part of your artistic vision, that's cool, but otherwise you're selling out your integrity for the sake of getting attention. Not worth it, and not a good message to put out there.
 
I suspect (and hope) that in your case, the Adult thing was something you already wanted to do anyway.
 
For anyone hoping to be competitive with the more established comics, I'm sure there have been threads on how to go about that. I would say it boils down to a few things: First of all, make sure you've got an exceptionally good comic. If your work isn't good enough to distinguish itself from the crowd, there's no reason to expect special attention. Beyond that, it's a matter of consistently updating and community participation (forums, community projects, talking to other artists on their pages so they know you're here). And also, promoting outside the Duckosphere can help. Modest Medusa is a good example of a webcomic that came out of nowhere and became an immediate popular favorite. It can be done, and done legitimately, but really I don't think most artists here are terribly interested in any of that. Most of us are just here for the community and to have fun posting and reading webcomics.
Reashi at 3:20PM, Jan. 24, 2014
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Yeah I figured all that out along the way. Like I said it was a long ways back and I killed the comic because I felt the same way bout the shoehorning : P
HippieVan at 10:11AM, Jan. 31, 2014
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El Cid wrote:
Unfortunately, I think most of that is going to be up to the admins and whether this current reclamation project of theirs is successful. For starters, they need to fix the PQs, fix the comic browser, and fix the comics so that users have more control over their layouts and can run their own ads.
 
What do you mean by the comic browser? Totally agree with the rest of that.
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El Cid at 9:10PM, Jan. 31, 2014
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I meant the Search function. Like, the first page is arranged by popularity, but if you try to go any further, it switches to alphabetical. If you try to specify what you're looking for, it goes to alphabetical. Pretty much, the popularity sorting is useless for you unless your comic happens to be on the front page.
 
And as a side note, if hypothetically I didn't want to see A- or E-rated comics when I visit the site, is there currently a functional way to do that? I've never bothered trying, but it doesn't seem to be obvious where that function is located.
Niccea at 4:22PM, Feb. 13, 2014
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Sorry to change the topic, but I was wondering people's opinion of timing of the awards. Usually the awards gear up in May, voting for nominees in July, judging in August, and the show is the September. Aside from site crashes, is this schedule working? What did people think about things being pushed to the awards starting the new year with a bang like this last itme?
El Cid at 7:31AM, Feb. 14, 2014
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I liked the original, with the awards happening in September. It seemed to go well with people's schedules and it all happens around a time of year when not much else is going on. Doing the awards around the holdiays, when people are traveling or busy doing family stuff will probably reduce the number of available volunteers and likely readers.
Niccea at 4:09PM, Feb. 15, 2014
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Noted, Noted. Do we want to stagger off the awards timing for 2014 since 2013 was finished barely a month ago, or should it just be kept the same? Almost everything but the juding and presenting was done on time last year so it was more like it was stretched out.
El Cid at 12:20PM, Feb. 17, 2014
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IMO it's not necessary to make any changes to 2014's DD Awards schedule. Sure, the 2013 ceremony ran a bit late, but that didn't affect the judging period for any of this year's prospective candidates. Pushing the date back just means more stuff to read for the judges this year (and who wants that!)
last edited on Feb. 17, 2014 12:21PM
Niccea at 7:09PM, March 24, 2014
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The two categories that didn't do to well last year:
 
Best Photo Comic
Best Pixel/Sprite/Stock Image Comic
 
These had the least votes or didn't have a good variety of nominees.
bravo1102 at 6:51AM, March 31, 2014
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Niccea wrote:
The two categories that didn't do to well last year:
 
Best Photo Comic
Best Pixel/Sprite/Stock Image Comic
 
These had the least votes or didn't have a good variety of nominees.
Let's get rid of them.  They're niche mediums and rare enough that they really don't need or deserve recognition unlike 3D/Poser as a specific medium.  Besides there just aren't any quality photo and Pixel/sprite comics worth reading let alone having an award for.  

And you know that is precisely what you're all thinking and believe.  If you didn't, my work would have as many readers as B.A.S.O. or Deviant Mind.  Be honest for once.
El Cid at 10:54AM, March 31, 2014
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This idea came up earlier and I think the decision was that we'd wait and see if a gaggle of new photocomics sprung up and got any kind of readership. Otherwise, it would make the most sense to stuff them in with the Best Use Of Media category, like Bravo was saying.
Niccea at 4:24PM, April 6, 2014
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According to the search engine only four comics with the label of of photographic have updated in the last month:
Character Development
Interstellar Blood Beasts
Pegwarmers
Rip Off
 
 In the case of the sprite comics, there are quite a few, but there is not a big voting turn out for them…ever. 
bravo1102 at 2:23AM, April 9, 2014
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Niccea wrote:
According to the search engine only four comics with the label of of photographic have updated in the last month:
Character Development
Interstellar Blood Beasts
Pegwarmers
Rip Off

Character Development has ended it's daily run and Interstellar Blood Beasts will be wrapping up in a couple of weeks.  That'll only leave two. 

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