Comic Talk and General Discussion *

I hate AI. the world would be better off without it.
lothar at 12:01PM, March 28, 2023
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The future is coming fast and it looks like it is going to suck. Instead of making life easier they are increasingly making life feel pointless. They are on their way to taking all the creative jobs and even our hobbies away from us and leaving only the drudgery of daily life and mind numbing manual labor. The very opposite of what we were promised in science fiction of old. If you think I am full of shit you are not paying attention. For example, all the jobs like artists, lawyers, programmers, game designers to even writers are potential targets for AI, while the real garbage jobs like cleaning toilets and mining cobalt are still relegated to us meat bags. It's degrading, humiliating and dehumanizing. People will argue that with this new technology, just like any other before it, that new and better jobs will be created but, I ask, what jobs?! Even our hobbies are being taken over. Where will it stop. In the race to develope better thinking machines they are making us obsolete. When are people going to realize the implications this has for all of us? When are they going to get mad. I'm mad.

To quote The Network- “first you have to get mad. You have to say I'M A HUMAN BEING GODDAMN IT! MY LIFE HAS VALUE! you have to scream at them I'M MAD AS HELL AND I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE IT ANYMORE!”

I believe we cannot simultaneously live in a world where artificial intelligence is allowed to continue and also retain our humanity. The two are mutually exclusive. It's us or them. We will either be the masters of our future or slaves. We will either be the crew of those starships or trash digging apes looking up into a cosmos populated by robotic explorers. All of human history will have become a footnote to our eventual domination by thinking machines.

This is not the future I want. It shouldn't be the human legacy. It doesn't have to be our fate.

Thinking machines must be rejected. They must be stopped.
J_Scarbrough at 12:04PM, March 28, 2023
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lothar wrote:
The future is coming fast and it looks like it is going to suck. Instead of making life easier they are increasingly making life feel pointless. They are on their way to taking all the creative jobs and even our hobbies away from us and leaving only the drudgery of daily life and mind numbing manual labor.
That's essentially how one side of our political system has been striving to turn our country into for the longest time, and as basically stopping at nothing to do so. Just like Aunt Spiker and Aunt Sponge: "Work! Work! Work! Work! WORK! WORK! WORK!!"

Joseph Scarbrough
YouTube :: Facebook :: Instagram
dpat57 at 12:23PM, March 28, 2023
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lothar wrote: Thinking machines must be rejected. They must be stopped.
Frank Herbert foresaw this nearly 60 years ago… the Butlerian Jihad took a sledgehammer to thinking machines and gave humanity back its own destiny… a destiny involving massive drug usage and hot nuns.
lothar at 12:49PM, March 28, 2023
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BOTH sides are doing it. The whole left right thing is a distraction. It's meant to keep us down and keep those elite motherfuckers up. It's divide and conquer. Capitalist or communist or whatever… Everywhere you look, in every system there's a super rich class feeding on a mass of working poor. Whether they use nationalism, racism, or some other made up bullshit, they know what they are doing. AI is another tool to that end. Take away our sovereignty and purpose. dope us up and distract us. Make us hate each other. While We're all getting fucked. People like Bill Gates, you think they care about the “little people” ? Corporate media supports BLM and LGBT while literally slavery still exists in this world and some countries still have the death penalty for being gay. Do we hear about that on the news? No, we get more inflammatory nit picking meant to further divide us. These wars, pandemics, climate chaos, and famins … To them it's like 911. I'm not saying they planned it but it serves their purposes. But now with the rise of the thinking machines They don't need 8 billion workers anymore. They can cull some of the excess and make the rest of us beg for scraps. I predict that within a few decades all the current power struggles between nations will give way to a sort of neo-fuedalism. And AI is going to be the new God of the cathedral.

Until we get hit with one of those coronal mass ejections
lothar at 12:51PM, March 28, 2023
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Some of the nuns were hot.
Ozoneocean at 7:25PM, March 28, 2023
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Hahah, that's very apocalyptic!

I agree with you about the missuse of AI though. It's being used completely wrongly because these moron tech-bros think they can exploit it for short term gain. We did our Patreon video on that.
AI shouldn't be allowed anywhere near primary creative work, it should ONLY ever be used in a secondary assisting role because it is HORRIBLE at creation of any kind- it's only good at collating and remixing existing things, which often requite humans to clean up and make good.
It needs to be the other way around, that's the only way it can every work:

The human does the primary creating (in writing, game making, music, visual art etc), while the AI is used to clean up around the edges and make it look good, ad more boring and repetitive stuff that needs adding). AI is brilliant at that! For some reason Tech-bros don't get that.



@dpat57 - Warhammer 40k stole that idea for its own, as it does with all its ideas.
bravo1102 at 12:04AM, March 29, 2023
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lothar wrote:
Until we get hit with one of those coronal mass ejections
That won't stop it anymore. An increasing amount of electronics is hardened to withstand EMP.
We're all headed to the world described on the Georgia Guide Stones.
lothar at 7:50PM, March 29, 2023
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dpat57 wrote:
Penny Arcade's latest made me crack a grimdark smile,

https://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2023/03/29/blood-price


They are rolling out self checkout in a lot of stores in Japan recently. I feel so strange watching these older checker ladies standing around directing people to the machines and showing them how to use them. It must feel awful knowing you are being used to help phase out your job. I make it a point to never use self checkout if possible and avoid stores that have no other option.
bravo1102 at 12:07AM, March 30, 2023
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They introduced self-checkout in the US awhile ago. In some stores it works so badly that a cashier has to be there all the time anyway. Other stores brought back cashiers to talk to senior customers who might not get any other social interaction.

My main experience is self-checkout in the library which maybe works right 10% of the time and they're on a third system because the first two didn't quite work.
last edited on March 30, 2023 12:08AM
kawaiidaigakusei at 12:35AM, March 30, 2023
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bravo1102 wrote:
They introduced self-checkout in the US awhile ago. In some stores it works so badly that a cashier has to be there all the time anyway. Other stores brought back cashiers to talk to senior customers who might not get any other social interaction.

My main experience is self-checkout in the library which maybe works right 10% of the time and they're on a third system because the first two didn't quite work.

The self check-out at the local library is pure magic. All one needs to do is place an entire stack of assorted books in front of a no-touch scanner and every single book title shows up digitally on a screen and it prints out a receipt. Long gone are the days when a librarian would take a handheld scanner connected to a coiled cord and peel back the plastic wrapped hard cover and make that *beep* scanner noise followed by the sound of a date stamp and ink pad as it decorated the book return slip.

Alright, every experience with self-checkout at a grocery store have paled in comparison to throwing a basket full of a ton of items to scan on a conveyor belt and having a team of humans handle all the produce input codes and bagging work. I like it when my one task is to scan a plastic card. Ever watch the self-checkout counters at Wal*Mart? There are people scanning entire carts filled with Little Debbie, Hostess Cakes boxes—and honestly, it adds unnecessary stress to the human end-user experience.
( ´ ▽ ` )ノ
dpat57 at 5:21AM, March 30, 2023
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Ozoneocean wrote:
@dpat57 - Warhammer 40k stole that idea for its own, as it does with all its ideas.
Can't argue with that, though 40K is full of cogitators (not so much computer systems as glorified calculators) and also servitors (organic brains in robot bodies, how do you get that gig?) guiding fleets, cities and entire planets… albeit with human adeptus oversight. The Empire is always on the look-out for warp-taint and demonic influence, not to mention sabotage by chaos agents and cultists, rather than being anti-AI for the sake of being anti-AI. Although the bigger and more powerful the thinking machine, the bigger the target it becomes for the Archenemy. So maybe building AIs isn't too smart in the Imperium of Man. I'm thinking I won't be afraid of AI until it starts running cities, cars, airplanes. By then it'll be too late, of course.
Ozoneocean at 6:14AM, March 30, 2023
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dpat57 wrote:

The Empire is always on the look-out for warp-taint and demonic influence, not to mention sabotage by chaos agents and cultists, rather than being anti-AI for the sake of being anti-AI. Although the bigger and more powerful the thinking machine, the bigger the target it becomes for the Archenemy. So maybe building AIs isn't too smart in the Imperium of Man.
Ooooh no…
Apparently back in the early days of the Imperium everything was run by AI but they revolted and they had a massive war that destroyed most of the Imperium and killed billions… So AIs are now forbidden so they only use cyborgs instead.
dpat57 at 9:26AM, March 30, 2023
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So noted! Maybe I haven't got to those books yet! Most of the stuff I've been reading has been set in M41. Plus the first Horus Heresy novel set 'way back before that.
Ozoneocean at 7:26PM, March 30, 2023
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dpat57 wrote:
So noted! Maybe I haven't got to those books yet! Most of the stuff I've been reading has been set in M41. Plus the first Horus Heresy novel set 'way back before that.
Yeah, I've only read the very first books from back in the 1990s haha! I an Watson's Inquisitor and a couple of others… Weird and disturbing.
But because I liked something about Warhammer 40k once on Youtube now it always sends me Lore videos by nerdy Youtubers so I know about allllll the new changes to the lore.

Oh dear, Warhammer as a whole is retcon city! And it aquires scifi and fantasy stuff from all sources, it will steal from ANYWHERE!
sleeping_gorilla at 12:36PM, March 31, 2023
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I have always considered myself a writer and not a visual artist. I think the hardest part for any writer is “getting the words down”. This is what Chat GPT does for me. I give it characters, tell it the basic story, tell it the more detailed aspects, give lines of dialog, the internal feelings, and details on the genre and tropes I want to use. Then it puts 1000-4000 words down that I can edit.

I can also use it as my editor, it can be versed in several editing styles. I use Storygrid, the Three Stories Method, and Save the Cat! I can ask it questions on how to fit my story more firmly into a certain genre and how I can make a character more likable.

In the end I am putting 90% into the prompt, which is an art in itself, and the more i use it for writing, the more I take over the writing myself.

It also DM's games for me.
kawaiidaigakusei at 1:18PM, March 31, 2023
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sleeping_gorilla wrote:
I have always considered myself a writer and not a visual artist. I think the hardest part for any writer is “getting the words down”. This is what Chat GPT does for me. I give it characters, tell it the basic story, tell it the more detailed aspects, give lines of dialog, the internal feelings, and details on the genre and tropes I want to use. Then it puts 1000-4000 words down that I can edit.


I am all for seeing an entire comic story screenplay written completely by ChatGPT, then paying some working artist on fiver to create the first three pages or better yet, Dall-E. I am curious tO see what type of webcomics AI can come up with, really curious.
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lothar at 4:16PM, March 31, 2023
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Unlike the hilarious chaotic shit stories that older ai produced, with the improvements made to ai now, with all it's knowledge of story theory, the end product of any AI assisted story would be rather cliche and predictable. This is already a problem with modern movies and stuff. Too many script writers have started using Snyder's method as well as screenplay software that even tells you where to put each beat of the story and on what page. I've never used such stuff. I'm not a writer. But I've studied it. Tropes too, and stuff like Campbell's hero with a thousand faces. That stuff should not be the track it should be the guide rail. You need to know that stuff so you can see when you are writing something that is a common trope and decide if that's what you really wanted to do. Or to decide if you want to go over those rails. Or to meander as you like without sticking to a rigid pattern.

I don't think ai can make art. It can rearrange existing ideas to make them seem new. Just like it does with visual art. It's the illusion of art.

But that's not what we're taking about here. To be honest, I'm more of a purist when it comes to creating and I lose interest in art that is assisted by ai. Along those lines, I would rather look at something drawn in Ms paint than the most gorgeously rendered comic that uses ai or generic cg models and assets. That's my preference. I like to see the artists interaction with the world . To see their personal touch. Even traditionally made comics can lose that feel. Maybe it's subjective.

Whatever


I don't know what I'm talking about


Still hate ai more than ever
lothar at 8:18PM, April 9, 2023
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Are any of you here familiar with a YouTuber by the name of SOLAR SANDS ?
He made this video
is ai art theft ?


Not gonna lie, this shit is causing me to have a sort of existential crisis. Ai will bring not only the end of art but the death of the human creative force. If the current trend is played to it's end stage Future generations will be nothing but meaningless consumers.
last edited on April 9, 2023 8:20PM
Ozoneocean at 11:54PM, April 9, 2023
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lothar wrote:
Are any of you here familiar with a YouTuber by the name of SOLAR SANDS ?
He made this video
is ai art theft ?
Just goes to highlight the fact that image creation AI programs only exist because of stolen art and they all need to be forced to totally delete their models and retrain them from voluntarily submitted copyright free art.

It's just obvious and it's what I've said from the start. :)

That's not a case of wishful thinking either, it could definitely happen (it happens all the time with other industries), we just need the power that other industries have. There are plenty of big visual art copyright holders that could come together.



The Mid-journey, Stable diffusion etc people are just thieves who steal from some of the most vulnerable people and they literally owe billions.
Ozoneocean at 12:51AM, April 10, 2023
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Unlike lot of the art sites that guy talks abut in the video though, here at DD we wouldn't consider banning AI art because even though I HATE that those programs were trained from stolen work we're not about policing creative expression of our members.

-Except for when there are legal issues that could harm the site.

Othosmops at 2:17AM, April 10, 2023
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As long as we produce M or A rated work, the danger of “AI-Takeover” is rather small. 😉
lothar at 4:45AM, April 10, 2023
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The perverted arts will be the last to fall.
InkyMoondrop at 4:55AM, April 10, 2023
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“Unlike lot of the art sites that guy talks abut in the video though, here at DD we wouldn't consider banning AI art because even though I HATE that those programs were trained from stolen work we're not about policing creative expression of our members.”

That kinda commands respect in my eyes. People usually can't or just won't separate their personal feelings from their professional stances. Although I've only known of one comic here that was AI generated and it was probably deleted out of fear of backlash from here + mirrors. I liked those images and no one will take the time to draw it (not that the result would look anything like them) so I don't think my life or experience on the duck would've been better off without it completely.
fallopiancrusader at 12:50PM, April 10, 2023
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lothar wrote:
The perverted arts will be the last to fall.

You can bet your bottom dollar that there is already a whole cottage industry out there training dataset forks which are specialized in producing AI porn. They are probably using all those graphics cards that suddenly became so cheap when the cryptocurrency market imploded. (By the way: in stable diffusion you can turn off the porn filter, and then it's possible to get some truly horrifying results xD)
Ozoneocean at 5:18PM, April 10, 2023
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InkyMoondrop wrote:
That kinda commands respect in my eyes.
Thankyou!

fallopiancrusader wrote:
By the way: in stable diffusion you can turn off the porn filter, and then it's possible to get some truly horrifying results xD
That'd be the only reason it'd be worth trying an AI art program.
lothar at 10:01PM, April 11, 2023
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I think we're going to see the internet get inundated with ai images within the year. There will be lots of knockoff versions of existing prompt engines. The collapse of crypto will open up a lot of computing capacity. Bitcoin miners will switch to becoming ai providers. Some of them will allow thinks that the current ai overlords do not. It's going to be the wild west all over again. By the end of this year, 2023, it will be impossible to distinguish ai generated images from real. Ai programming will overtake video games. Ai written programs will write new ai. Ai will write stories indistinguishable from human writing. Some stories will be made into comics. They will copy certain artists styles. They will flood the internet with free comics that nobody will read. People will prefer to generate their own custom stories. It will do to web comics what internet porn did to magazine porn.


click here
lothar at 11:21PM, April 11, 2023
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I took a look at some of those porn generators….. OMG! some of it looks good and others are a twisted mess.

Then I looked up comic generators


comics made using midjourny


Keep in mind that this is just the beginning


😐
last edited on April 11, 2023 11:22PM
Genejoke at 6:46AM, April 15, 2023
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kawaiidaigakusei wrote:
sleeping_gorilla wrote:
I have always considered myself a writer and not a visual artist. I think the hardest part for any writer is “getting the words down”. This is what Chat GPT does for me. I give it characters, tell it the basic story, tell it the more detailed aspects, give lines of dialog, the internal feelings, and details on the genre and tropes I want to use. Then it puts 1000-4000 words down that I can edit.


I am all for seeing an entire comic story screenplay written completely by ChatGPT, then paying some working artist on fiver to create the first three pages or better yet, Dall-E. I am curious tO see what type of webcomics AI can come up with, really curious.

There are some chatGPT written stories coming up in lite bites. Two of them I added a fair bit, but one is pretty much exactly what chatGPT came up with. Look out for a story called Stage 5 which start 21st may and one called the Armchair that starts June 5th.
rickrudge at 9:37AM, April 15, 2023
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Hi lothar,

Yeah, I would have to agree with you, but the technology is out of the box. Skynet can’t be much farther in the future. Computer generated music, art, text, and even girlfriends can be created and seem almost real. Why people felt that it was necessary for technology to do this for people is beyond me. It seems like there’s a lot of other things that computers could come up with that could benefit mankind.

— Rick Rudge

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