General Discussion

Drunk Duck Wiki?
Evil Emperor Nick at 3:00PM, June 11, 2008
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Alright I don't know to much about this so I'm just putting it out there as a trial ballon but what would it take/how realistic would be it be to start a Drunk Duck Wiki site where people could make entries about their comics?

It seems like thre are wikis poping of just about everything from TV tropes to obscure video games. It seems like it could be a real good thing for the community. I know there are a few comics I read like Fight I wouldn't mind making and entry on and I know for a fact that DD comic wikipedia pages go up almost as fast as they come back down.

Anyone have a thought or some info on the idea?

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
Arashi_san at 3:14PM, June 11, 2008
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I actually think it's a really good idea. I'm all for it. The only problem is that it would almost certainly never happen. :(
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last edited on July 14, 2011 11:00AM
Custard Trout at 3:44PM, June 11, 2008
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Edit: Usedbooks is smarter than me, so now I agree with her.

I still agree with Arashi, though.
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last edited on July 14, 2011 12:01PM
usedbooks at 5:26PM, June 11, 2008
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Could work, but there is a wiki for webcomics: http://www.comixpedia.org/

It might be worthwhile if DDers took an active part there instead of starting one up. I put in an entry for my comic (haven't updated it in a while, though).
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:37PM
FoxmanZEO at 6:00PM, June 11, 2008
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Bleh, self edited wikis.

I have nothing further to add.
'Who must do the hard things?

He who can.'


-Confucius.
last edited on July 14, 2011 12:30PM
TheMidge28 at 8:05PM, June 11, 2008
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its an interesting idea EEN. but would only DDers read it?
and who would maintain it?
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:25PM
DAJB at 11:19PM, June 11, 2008
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Evil Emperor Nick
DD comic wikipedia pages go up almost as fast as they come back down.
True. Although they frequently deny it, there is clearly a strong bias against webcomics among some of the guys at Wikipedia and, since there's no effective mechanism for the others to keep their prejudices in check, webcomic entries are almost always deleted, irrespective of the success, popularity or “notability” (!) of the comic in question.

usedbooks
there is a wiki for webcomics: http://www.comixpedia.org/
I agree with usedbooks, we'd help ourselves more if we were to support the webcomic wiki that already exists at Comixpedia. Creating a new wiki exclusively for DD webcomics would only undermine the position of that one. Strength in numbers and all that!

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:03PM
SpANG at 6:58AM, June 12, 2008
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DAJB
usedbooks
there is a wiki for webcomics: http://www.comixpedia.org/
I agree with usedbooks, we'd help ourselves more if we were to support the webcomic wiki that already exists at Comixpedia. Creating a new wiki exclusively for DD webcomics would only undermine the position of that one. Strength in numbers and all that!
I too agree with this. Reasons are as follows:

1. Comixpedia maintains it.
2. Comixpedia loves webcomics
3. Comixpedia is a third-party source, so entries will be less biased.
4. Comixpedia maintains it.

It would be nice to give them linkage on the front page.
“To a rational mind, nothing is inexplicable. Only unexplained.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:53PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 8:28AM, June 12, 2008
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SpANG
DAJB
usedbooks
there is a wiki for webcomics: http://www.comixpedia.org/
I agree with usedbooks, we'd help ourselves more if we were to support the webcomic wiki that already exists at Comixpedia. Creating a new wiki exclusively for DD webcomics would only undermine the position of that one. Strength in numbers and all that!
I too agree with this. Reasons are as follows:

1. Comixpedia maintains it.
2. Comixpedia loves webcomics
3. Comixpedia is a third-party source, so entries will be less biased.
4. Comixpedia maintains it.

It would be nice to give them linkage on the front page.

I think you really miss the point. A DD wiki first off would be a good for building the community which is supposedly DD's best point something comixpedia won't ever do. Comixpedia, with the exception of mega comics like 8-bit theater and VG Cats are all pretty much entered by the creators. The enteries in comixpedia are very much biased and certainly not 3rd Party for the most part.

I for one feel that a DD wiki would be much better served informally as is the case with the TV Tropes Wiki. The idea would encourage people to talk about comics they enjoy which doesn't really happen on comixpedia.

Second off off creating a DD wiki does in no way hurts or discourages Comixpedia. A lot of sites pull info from each other. If anyone really cared about comixpedia it would be very easy to copy the enteries from a DD wiki to comixpedia. I mean by that logic why even have comixpedia since we have the universal all knowing wonderful wikipeida right? Except we all know that it really doesn't work like that.

Further a DD wiki would allow us to put a lot of information into the articles. Why do MMO's all have their own wiki? ‘Cause there is a lot on info and articles which need to be covered in order to really be useful the community of that MMO. Sure they all have wikipages on Wikipedia but that doesn’t really help the MMO community. I would suggest while not the same there are similar reasons here for a more local wiki.

If the community isn't for it, well that is that. A DDwiki would have no value without the DD community behind it but I think it short sighted to simply write it off in favor on the very community vacant comixpedia.

As for who would read it? Well probably fans looking for a little extra information and well DDwikiers. I know some of the more complex comics with large archives would no doubt benefit from it a great deal. It might even encourage comics to mirror here if we can get a more active and vibrant community of article writers then comixpedia.

Who would maintain it? Well if we did this right the DD community would with a little administrative oversight in case of vandals and trouble makers.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
killersteak at 9:18AM, June 12, 2008
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So if it was made how would it get exposure? A link on the front page next to that chat room link or something?
Who's making it? Volte? Maybe he'll get around to setting it up after he's done fixing the image/avatar bug?
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:15PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 9:39AM, June 12, 2008
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It should be self promoting within the community if it got set up. Presumably people would link their comics to the DD wiki page for readers benefit and thus people would become aware of it simply though reading their favorite comics.

As to who is making it, well I presume we would Request a Wiki and then simply start to populate it with articles after it was set up for us like any other wikia. Not all roads lead to Volts you know, besides community projects are best done by the community.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
SpANG at 9:50AM, June 12, 2008
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Yeah, I guess I'm missing the point. I just see no added value.

When I go over to comicgenesis and browse their comics that way, I just find it annoying and bland-looking. :/

Plus, it will be yet another area we'd have to mod for trolls.
“To a rational mind, nothing is inexplicable. Only unexplained.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:53PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 10:28AM, June 12, 2008
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The value added would be the community. In general a wiki is not good for browsing for new pop culture interstes as a short summery isn't always representative of the whole of the series, after all how much humor can you get out of the wiki pages on say a Doglas Adams book? It is however excellent for summeries, extra information, triva and in this case community building.

Not to be snide or to suggest anything unkind but I'd suggest maybe part of the reason you don't see the value is that GoA already has a wikipedia page so naturally what value would you personally get out of a smaller wiki. And, if indeed that is what you are saying, your right GoA probably wouldn't get any benefit, however the point is not simply to self promote (as is the failure of comixpedia) but to hopefully bring the DD fans & creator together on something.

The TV trops wiki has a pretty good community behind because it is a relaxed opinionated atmosphere where people actually ENJOY adding new content as opposed to most wikis were everytime you try and add something the mods decend upon you groves demanding concensus and proof of importance.

I'd suggest that, since most people would probably want to keep their wiki pages from getting trolled most people & their fans would help police their own & hopefully go out and start writting on other comics they enjoy on DD. Like I said in order for it to work the community would have to get behind it.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
SpANG at 10:34AM, June 12, 2008
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Soooo…. Just make it then. If people join, great!

EDIT// Actually, when I was suggesting “no added value” I meant we have a profiles section, people can make their own character sheets, whatever. I just don't see and will continue to not see the point. Maybe when it actually becomes a physical thing and I can look at it, I'll have a different perspective. ;)
“To a rational mind, nothing is inexplicable. Only unexplained.”
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:53PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 10:52AM, June 12, 2008
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Well because I've found sometimes people consider it a bit….arrogant…if you go off and so something like this without sending up a test ballon first and I don't want to put a hex on the whole thing before it started. Tomorrow is Friday the 13th after all. ;)

I do apreciate your honesty SpANG, its always good to have someone who can respectfully but totally disagree with you. ^_^

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
skoolmunkee at 11:38AM, June 12, 2008
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I'm also seeing little additional value in a DD-only wiki. It may be pro-DD community but it seems anti-webcomics community. I don't think we have to have our own version of everything- if the comixpedia wiki is already set up and working, then there's no functional difference between that and a DD wiki. There's also the idea of potential audience- DD people would visit a DD wiki, but non-DD people would be more likely to visit a comixpedia wiki. If enough DD articles were on the comixpedia wiki then DD people would go there- especially if we pointed people at it as the main wiki place.

wiki wiki wo wiki

To be honest, at this point it would be silly to start thinking about adding more features to DD, as someone has already mentioned, we can't even get bad bugs fixed. Even if someone made a DD wiki it still wouldn't be linked in to DD other than urls people code into their own pages.

I agree that a wiki is a functional and viable alternative to coding character pages, etc., is that too much granularity for comixpedia's wiki or do they not care how many individual articles a webcomic has?
  IT'S OLD BATMAN
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:41PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 12:56PM, June 12, 2008
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A DD wiki could be community oriented, which comixpedia isn't there is a bunch of individuals posting about their comic. There isn't a larger web comic culture. There is a lot of individuals doing their thing a small groups of friends and collaborators.

The advantage of a DD wiki is it could be informal as I've said before and help build up the DD community and allow (in theory) greater content for DD comics. Comixpedia is a fine site, but it has a totally different aim. However those aims need not be at odds. A DD community site could still work hand in had with comixpeidia simply by article trading which is common enough between similar wikis. That one you could have both the benefit of supporting the insular DD community and the larger web comics community, such as it is, with compixpedia.

I don't see how image bugs or any other reported problems would in anyway prove a problem to people providing links on their comic pages. Lots of comics already have links to other page, vote buttons, stores, donations button and so on and so forth with out issue. Why would the DD wiki along suffer some unspecified problem? I fail to see a need to link this into DD other then urls coded into people's own pages.

Obviously this project will go as far as people's enthusiasm will take it (which at the moment doesn't seem to be much). Hence my attempt to outline its virtues and generate interest before moving forward with it. It only takes a few people with enthusiasm….but that number is still higher then one person (whom already looses countless hours a week to unpaid over time and working on comics). But hey if I get fired for replying to forums when I should be working I'd certainly be willing to try and get it started on my own. :P Heck knowing me I might do it anyway if at least a few people get excited about it. ^_^

For the record I can't find anything limiting comcis to one page on Comixpedia but all comic seem to be me only one page articles. Further I'll point out many of their articles are taken from Wikipedia. Again I'll point out if we made a good wiki site comixpedia would probably just do the same and copy our articles into itself.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
skoolmunkee at 1:40PM, June 12, 2008
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Evil Emperor Nick
I don't see how image bugs or any other reported problems would in anyway prove a problem to people providing links on their comic pages. Lots of comics already have links to other page, vote buttons, stores, donations button and so on and so forth with out issue. Why would the DD wiki along suffer some unspecified problem? I fail to see a need to link this into DD other then urls coded into people's own pages.

My point with bringing up the bug was that if we want the DD wiki to be something that, realistically, a sustainable number of people will use, then it needs to be something that's built into the site with prominent linkage, a ‘wiki’ spot on the templates (like the ‘recommended comics’ block), etc. Whoever's managing DD now wouldn't be getting around to that any time soon.

I know that anyone can make a wiki page, but the vast majority of DD users either don't know how to code html or have no desire to go messing with it beyond the default templates. Plus, the people who are using the templates (except black and white) CAN'T mess with the code unless they want to de-engineer the html and plug it all back in as a custom template. That means that the most linkage the wiki would get from most comic authors is an ongoing notice in their authors comments, which is a pretty crap way to do things. I mean, it's a start, and it's better than nothing, but lack of integration with DD's system is going to make the wiki plateau at a much sooner stage than otherwise.

Wishful thinking, but what DD really needs to do is get with the whole ‘widget’ game and let people custom-build their pages out of blocks and rss-fed content, in that case you would not only be able to make easy links to wiki entries but you would have whole other potentials with mixtures of content and community.

Sigh, if only I had 100,000 bucks…
  IT'S OLD BATMAN
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:41PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 2:27PM, June 12, 2008
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skoolmunkee
Sigh, if only I had 100,000 bucks…

You and me both Skoolmunkee.

Well I guess I just have more faith the community. If people want something, like say PW ads, bad enough if they don't know how & can't find instructions they just ask someone who does. I'm sure if peopel started showing wiki links on their pages people would start asking them how they did it. ^_^

Granted with intigration and million dollars we could do a heck of lot more with the idea, but that doesn't mean it has to all or nothing right?

Off the subject but stuff like this REALLY makes me miss the old Author's signatures. I'm not of the people that longs for the good old days ('cause the site was down so much back then and constantly loosing oru data as I remember it) but author's sigs is one of the few things I really miss from the past versions of DD. I miss it, I really do. I used to use that for all sorts of things from web comics rings to community comics. That would really simplfy this whole discussion.

Maybe I'll got suggest it to Volts that he needs to add that feature to the site again. :P

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
Raccoo at 9:47PM, June 12, 2008
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Will the create-a-wiki website host the wiki or will we have to find one?

What were author's signatures like?
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:57PM
LakAttack at 1:46AM, June 13, 2008
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nowadays, the internet is nothing but a wasteland of half finished poorly maintained wikis. You know it's a far fetched idea to think a site that's so poorly run as it is could maintain a whole set of pages about the comics that it poorly manages.
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:27PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 7:02AM, June 13, 2008
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Raccoo
Will the create-a-wiki website host the wiki or will we have to find one?

What were author's signatures like?

They were just like any on sign except the would be attached to the bottom of your author's notes when you updated a comic.

From what I understand wikia would host it. We would just have to do the work of setting up the site & making it presentable hence why it is a larger then one person project but one that still could be started by a relatively small team. Of course it would only be successful if the idea caught on DD users & readers started using it.

LakAttack
nowadays, the internet is nothing but a wasteland of half finished poorly maintained wikis. You know it's a far fetched idea to think a site that's so poorly run as it is could maintain a whole set of pages about the comics that it poorly manages.

You seem to have some major misconceptions about the DD wiki concept.

1. That this would have anything to do with the DD management. As a community run site hosted by wikia it would have nothing to do with the current management and thus any problems here would in no way effec the wiki.

2. That people capable of updating hundreds of pages over years and years would somehow be totally incapable of contributing to a wiki.

3. That other unrelated people's failure should some how dictate how successful you or I or anyone else can be.

4. That it is better to give up before you start rather then try and risk failure.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM
ozoneocean at 7:03AM, June 13, 2008
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I have a wiki at comic gen and comixepedia…
Actually I'm with Nick. It's not like it's either or, Wiki is just an easy way to make charatersheets for you stuff etc. You'd still use comixepedia or whatever if you were motivated to, but it'd be nice to have it as an intergrated feature here.

You wouldn't need to troll hunt if only the creator and nominated assistants had editing rights, the way they do already with comics, so easy. Mayabe that would be the default setting and you could have the option to open it to all commers, but only if you wanted to.

Nice idea :)

————-

On an external site though there are other issues… When there's no official DD oversight and the external thing goes decidedly dodgy, look very bad for DD. Those sorts of issues is why the DD chatroom isn't official…
And if we wanted an external Wiki, HPK has already offered that I think.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:31PM
Evil Emperor Nick at 7:14AM, June 13, 2008
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Really? I'll have to talk to HPK then. Thanks!

Yea I agree an intigrated site similar to the user forums would be best & easiest but not even I'm enough of an optimist to think that is going to happen anytime soon. The external wiki is just what we the community can do on our own right now if we want to of course which so far it doesn't really look to be the case sadly.

last edited on July 14, 2011 12:23PM

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