General Discussion

apple, the technological fascists
Sidwarrious at 6:20PM, Nov. 3, 2007
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Why can't we be friends? Why can't we be friends? Why can't we be friends?

This is why I am glad I'm poor and can't afford these things anyway so I don;t have to deal with these problems!

…..

….

I'm gonna go cry now.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:36PM
Vindibudd at 7:11PM, Nov. 3, 2007
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subcultured
apple is the one that sank the car, there's your analogy.
they broke it purposely

Apple didn't make you take it back to them for an update. They can make an update that only works on their phones. So if you mod your phone and then download an update for it and then complain because it doesn't work, then it isn't Apple's fault. Take some personal responsibility for God's sake.

subcultured
you buy a car, you mod it to drive on water, then an apple guy comes in and shoot holes in your boat. you go to the store “WTF, man!”.
guy goes…“you broke it by moding it.”

evil i say.

Apple didn't hunt down all the hacked iPhones. That's where your rebuttal breaks down.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
subcultured at 7:21PM, Nov. 3, 2007
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no warning from apple…people thought it was just an update for itunes.

people who put harmless 3rd party program like a ringtone maker got their phone bricked. no other phone does that…the reason apple did that was they would also lose money with their 99cents ringtones.

same reason why they brick the unlocked phones, so that apple can keep getting the percentage from AT&T

that is what i call manipulative evil greedy.
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
Vindibudd at 7:50PM, Nov. 3, 2007
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subcultured
no warning from apple…people thought it was just an update for itunes.

people who put harmless 3rd party program like a ringtone maker got their phone bricked. no other phone does that…the reason apple did that was they would also lose money with their 99cents ringtones.

same reason why they brick the unlocked phones, so that apple can keep getting the percentage from AT&T

that is what i call manipulative evil greedy.


Here you are faulting Apple for the exact same thing that every single wireless carrier does. Verizon charges an ungodly price for ringtones. And the programs that they allow you to use, they get kickbacks from. Same with ATT and every other one out there. As a matter of fact, everything that you are mad at Apple about is done in one way or another by every other computer and phone company out there.

Apple has every right to make a product and expect a profit from it. Why are you so up in arms about wanting to take the product that Apple makes and completely screw them out of the money that the market says they deserve for creating it? Instead of being so pissed about it, just get a different phone.

That's what I don't get about the whole Apple Hate Squad. No one is making you use Apple products. Greedy? BS. Evil? No. It's capitalism and classical liberalism whole-heartedly endorses it. If you don't like it, I am sure your Nokia works just fine with whatever company you roll with.

Apple said, one carrier. Then people bought the phone and said, “HAHA F*CK YOU APPLE, I CAN MAKE IT WORK ON MY PHONE COMPANY LOLOMG!” and Bam, Apple updates it and they start crying. So it's okay to screw Apple but not for the screwers? Turnabout is fair play, boys and girls.

Just like it is not okay to pirate a movie or a song it is not okay to pirate hardware. You can buy a movie but it is not your right to send it to everyone else on the planet. You can buy an iPhone, but it is not your right to hand it to every other company that Apple does not have a partnership with and that is what people are doing. I don't see what the obsession is with taking an iPhone and running it on something other than ATT. I really don't. Other phones are locked down to single carriers but oh no Apple does it and we can hear the Four Horsemen saddling up. For real. get a grip you people.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
subcultured at 7:59PM, Nov. 3, 2007
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first time i've heard of a phone shutting down because they can't make money off it.
“buy our other product or we break break your phone” WOW it pisses me off that they have the audacity to strong arm people. to me it's like a protection money that you give to the mob.

apple failed me, i will never buy another apple product. i felt betrayed…i mean i was so excited about iphone i made this http://www.drunkduck.com/Dreams_in_Synergy/html/extra.html now i kow the true face of apple and i don't like it. this company let me down. that is why i'm pissed off.

i have the right to be pissed off.


J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
spacehamster at 3:29AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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The car analogy only works if we figure in the makers of roads. Because that's really the problem here. People are modding their cars, against the express wish of the manufacturer, to be able to drive on water, then coming back to the road and finding that the people who make roads have decided they don't want cars that can drive on water on their roads because the road people have a deal with the car people. And apparently the whole thing is being taken to court now to see if the road makers and the car manufacturers should be allowed to work together like that.

Apple is a corporation that wants to make as much money as possible. If there's a benevolent mobile phone manufacturer out there that gives away cellphones for free and pats their customers on the back for hacking the software on them, I haven't heard of ‘em yet. Apple managed to completely dominate the market for mp3 players within a few years by turning them into fashion accessories. Cellphones are already considered fashion accessories by a lot of the people who buy them, so that market looks perfect for Apple to break into. And now they’re trying to throw their weight as the inventors of the iPod around to take the biggest slice of that market possible. That's what corporations do. They try to make money.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
subcultured at 4:12AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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they break phones with malicious intent even if a person just put a ringmaker program or a gps type map that isn't supported by apple. apple also released a statement about letting 3rd party be intstalled into their phones without bricking it, but they didn't release a statement about unbricking people's phones…even if it was legally unlocked, yet they just put a 3rd party program.

apple won't even look at your phone if it's bricked, because they think you're a hacker trying to pull one over them.

i would think this kind of aggressive marketing would make them lose customers (like me) therefore lose profit in future with their other products.
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
ozoneocean at 4:27AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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Blah, blah… You bought a phone, for WAY too much but you don't even own it even after that… That's the plain fact. All your analogies suck. And Apple doesn't do it so they can make more profit from you specifically anyway, so people thinking along those lines have it wrong: They do it because they made a deal with AT&T to make them the exclusive carrier. If they let you do your own thing, they get in trouble with AT&T.
spacehamster
I replaced my Windows PC with a Mac Pro last week. I am never ever ever in a million years going back to Windows.
No one on earth is more fanatical than the converted… No matter what they've been converted to or from, it's just one of those things lol!

Meh, Widows isn't bad for what it does, seeing as it has to be reasonably user friendly and at the same time be able to run on 6 bazillion different user configurations that are updating and changing all the time as new tech comes out. Apple simply can not and would never do that. With Apple you buy a hardware AND software package that's specifically designed for each other, so obviously it's going to be able to run better and it does! The disadvantage will always be price, at every stage: buying, fixing, upgrading, and even the cost of software and games (and if it's not more $$ for SW that's because it's slower to come out), and the price differential is because of the smaller user base and the fact there's much less competition among hardware and software producers.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:28PM
spacehamster at 4:41AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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ozoneocean
They do it because they made a deal with AT&T to make them the exclusive carrier. If they let you do your own thing, they get in trouble with AT&T.

I'm not sure I see how this contradicts what I was saying… Apple and AT&T have an agreement, and they can work together to force their customers to do things like only use the software they want them to use. Two corporations using their position to maximize profit.

Also, just to throw this in here, my understanding is the reason the exclusive deal with AT&T exists is that Apple wanted a share of all profits made from the use of the iPhones, and AT&T was the only carrier willing to take that deal. That's what I meant when I said Apple are throwing their weight around - they're basically saying “we're the inventors of the iPod, and this is going to be the next big thing on the useless overpriced gizmos market. If you want in on it, you play by our rules.”

Again, not strange behavior for a corporation. They exist to make money. What's happening here, though, is that it's starting to look like they overestimated their leverage and too many people are refusing to play their game. Which is strange, because Apple is usually excellent at emotional marketing, and now people are mad at them.

With Apple you buy a hardware AND software package that's specifically designed for each other, so obviously it's going to be able to run better and it does! The disadvantage will always be price

So, um, you pay more for a device that works better. Sounds pretty reasonable to me.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
ozoneocean at 5:06AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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spacehamster
I'm not sure I see how this contradicts what I was saying.
And I wasn't disputing what you were saying, that's why I wrote above the quote, that was addressed generally ;)
But yeah, it's their business practise. Of course it's shoddy because you don't actually own what you've paid enough too own. But these days the practise is becoming common and Apple are by no means the first to do it.
spacehamster
So, um, you pay more for a device that works better. Sounds pretty reasonable to me.
That's not what I was saying at all, and I wasn't arguing or contradicting you, just explaining why this was so.

What you're paying for is a well made device (the quality), plus a large mark-up that exists because there's less demand and lower competition in this business model.

With Windows and PCs (two very separate components), you pay less because of superior competition and large demand. As far as hardware goes the sky is the limit of course in every aspect (quality, aesthetics, power…). With the OS it is limited because of the vast hardware choice available. Ignoring silly stuff about it being a beta, being less secure, being buggy; what makes it not as good as the current Mac OS is the fact that with no simple standardised high end hardware, it simply can't reach the heights that OSX can on extremely high end systems.

That's the only reason I'm considering buying a G5.
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:28PM
spacehamster at 5:51AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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ozoneocean
What you're paying for is a well made device (the quality), plus a large mark-up that exists because there's less demand and lower competition in this business model.

I'm not going to deny the markup on Macs, and it's silly to treat Apple as if they're not acting like monopolists in their segment of the market because they are.

But just as a side note, if you buy a brand name Windows PC like, say, a Compaq, you're not really getting off all that much cheaper. What's cheaper is the machines you get from discount chains, which more often than not contain shitty, mismatched components. To really get a better deal, you have to build your own machine.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
spacehamster at 5:54AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter.
last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
Vindibudd at 10:25AM, Nov. 4, 2007
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ozoneocean
That's the only reason I'm considering buying a G5.

Are they selling G5s in Australia? Because you can't buy a new one in the U.S. If you do buy one, get one with an Intel Core Duo.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
ozoneocean at 2:03PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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Vindibudd
Are they selling G5s in Australia?
Well, no one's ever had any trouble buying them before… I don't know about the latest ones currently in the shops, but through the Apple Australia website they seemed to be offering them. I can leave it for a few months anyway.
Vindibudd
If you do buy one, get one with an Intel Core Duo.
Naw… The only reason I was considering one is because they can have 2 of the 64 bit Xeon quadcore processors and take full advantage of them. Plus the massive ram capacity… 32 bit Windows can't even use 4 gig to the max. :(

Ah, they do have 4 hard drive bays… but only 750 gig max in each…? I probably won't but one though, the price isn't worth it for the setup… :( I can better use a lot of that cash on other things. ($8,603.99 is what I'm looking at for the config I'd like)(
spacehamster
Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter
That's unfortunate, and strange seeing as the pics of the Plat employees I've seen show them using Mac books… lol!
Ah, Safari isn't that great anyway… I always found i lame. There are a lot of good browsers for the Mac that'd work better. :)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:28PM
bbr at 3:00PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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OSX 10.5 beats Vista by several miles tbh.
I could list the reasons… but i want to get some sleep in a few minutes, and i'd be writing for several hours if i did :P

Apple is doing quite alright.
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:15AM
ozoneocean at 3:40PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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bbr
OSX 10.5 beats Vista by several miles tbh.
Yeah, lets not get into that ok? It's great, but only on the machines that are specifically designed for it, because it's designed for them. Windows whatever is much better for the price because it's designed to work with much, much, much, more hardware, which is also why it doesn't perform nearly as well. Different philosophies and set-ups. Let's cut the fan-boyisim. ;)
 
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:28PM
Vindibudd at 3:40PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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spacehamster
Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter.

It works just fine on my macbook.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
spacehamster at 3:58PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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Vindibudd
spacehamster
Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter.

It works just fine on my macbook.

Really? Weird. If I hit any of the BBCode buttons, it sends the post, so I have to type in all of the code manually. You don't have this problem?

last edited on July 14, 2011 3:50PM
subcultured at 6:55PM, Nov. 4, 2007
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spacehamster
Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter.
\

get used to that
it's like buying a ps3 :)
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
subcultured at 8:18PM, Nov. 6, 2007
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i just thought of something…
what if you aren't satisfied with AT&T because it keeps dropping your calls, would you get your money back since the iphone would no longer work without the sim card?

i mean that's $600 of equipment that you can no longer use because you kept getting bad reception from at&T. there's prolly some kind of fee for deactivating early too…i think the contract is 2 years. would you suffer for 2 years just so you won't get screwed with a bricked phone?

damn, apple and at&t are geniuses!

J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
bongotezz at 10:39AM, Nov. 7, 2007
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new iphone update

http://blog.wired.com/business/2007/11/iphone-firmware.html
last edited on July 14, 2011 11:32AM
Vindibudd at 12:37PM, Nov. 7, 2007
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spacehamster
Vindibudd
spacehamster
Also, as a recent convert, I'd like to restate how annoying it is that this board isn't Safari compliant. Muttermutter.

It works just fine on my macbook.

Really? Weird. If I hit any of the BBCode buttons, it sends the post, so I have to type in all of the code manually. You don't have this problem?



Yeah, but I don't really care. I just type the code out.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
Vindibudd at 12:40PM, Nov. 7, 2007
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subcultured
i just thought of something…
what if you aren't satisfied with AT&T because it keeps dropping your calls, would you get your money back since the iphone would no longer work without the sim card?

i mean that's $600 of equipment that you can no longer use because you kept getting bad reception from at&T. there's prolly some kind of fee for deactivating early too…i think the contract is 2 years. would you suffer for 2 years just so you won't get screwed with a bricked phone?

damn, apple and at&t are geniuses!



This is one thing I do have a problem with. Most companies require a 2 year contract to subsidize the cost of the phone. Not so with the iPhone. You are paying for the phone and then they (att) are demanding that you use the phone with them for 2 years no matter what. This is a rip off.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
Poke Alster at 9:16AM, Nov. 9, 2007
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Vindibudd
This is one thing I do have a problem with. Most companies require a 2 year contract to subsidize the cost of the phone. Not so with the iPhone. You are paying for the phone and then they (att) are demanding that you use the phone with them for 2 years no matter what. This is a rip off.

I do agree that it is a rip-off but many people dont , millions of people in britain are waiting for the phone at the shops, sat outside and it comes out in 2 days!
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM
subcultured at 9:19AM, Nov. 9, 2007
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reminds me of ps3
J
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:03PM
Poke Alster at 9:25AM, Nov. 9, 2007
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Yep exactly like PS3 and, not trying to upset anyone, but wasnt it a big let down? wasnt it meant to be the greatest thing ever? but wasnt?
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM
Vindibudd at 10:40AM, Nov. 9, 2007
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Poke Alster
Yep exactly like PS3 and, not trying to upset anyone, but wasnt it a big let down? wasnt it meant to be the greatest thing ever? but wasnt?

The PS3 is the greatest thing ever if you want a Blu-ray player.
last edited on July 14, 2011 4:42PM
Poke Alster at 11:15AM, Nov. 9, 2007
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Yep i understand that but im on about the games and things like that
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM
marine at 12:10PM, Nov. 9, 2007
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subcultured
reminds me of ps3

And everything else stupid people wait for.c Remember Star Wars? Every BIG new video game that comes out now?
last edited on July 14, 2011 1:53PM
Poke Alster at 12:21PM, Nov. 11, 2007
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yep, for pokemon diamond people waited for 4 days! crazy,
last edited on July 14, 2011 2:46PM

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