I hope the study goes well!

——-

I'm having relationship issues, but not really because of anything emotional in cause.
My partner drinks too much and it interacts with her ADHD medication. She becomes depressed, sad, aggressive, and accuses me of all sorts of things.

Yesterday while I was in bed she was screaming, I didn't really know what about because I had in headphones to block out the sound of her loud TV. I assumed it was at the neighbours or people outside.
I took the headphones out and asked her what was up. She shouted some semi distinct things at me and I asked her to repeat them. Next thing I know she'd come into the room and climbed up on the bed and holding a knife over me, waving it about.

I was in shock from that point on.
Lucky she left without doing anything. I got dressed, took a minimum and things and ran out of there.

She's generally a really good person but those incidents after drinking are getting worse. She always pretends they didn't happen. It's never come to holding knives though.
Unless she gets treatment or agrees to stop drinking then we can't have a relationship. Not because I don't like her but because it can't actually work. I don't want to risk being stabbed.

Wow! @ozoneocean, I'm speechless.

I've never experienced such a thing, and I can't imagine all the mixed feelings going through your head.
Thankfully, you're safe (and she's too, I hope). I hope you could find the help she needs, well in case you still want to be with her.
The worst part is that you could do anything to help the other person, but if the other person doesn't have the will to accept their problem and accept your help, maybe there's nothing much for you there.

Please don't get me wrong, I really wish both of you could be togheter.

Thanks for that Avart.
That's the thing- she needs help.
At the very least she needs to stop drinking. If that can happen then we can reassess but it's not looking good.

Oz! This is so much, and so relatable at the same time. I have dated a person who liked the drink way too much, much more than I care to admit and it is a (cliché, yet appropriate) roller coaster ride of emotions.

Please, be careful and do not get stabbed! I draw the line at dangerous weapons aimed at my face. However, mixing alcohol (…and maybe more) with ADHD medication does get a bit wonky at times. I am talking from personal experience when having to witness someone I knew get into arguments with strangers on the streets and taking a lot of anger out on me while always blaming it on the alcohol.

One thing I did learn was that cutting out alcohol cold turkey is very dangerous for someone who drinks daily. There needs to be a gradual reduction of the amounts.

It is hard because you care about the person, but a different side of them comes out after a few drinks.

At least she didn't try to stab you. One of my exes attacked and I had to wrestle the knife out of her hand. But then she had bipolar disorder not ADHD.

You have to be honest with yourself and ask if you're ready for this and are you willing to do what is required. Noone will change unless they want to and you can't force someone to change nor is it within your control. How committed are you and how committed are you willing to become.

I've been there.

Eh, the relationship is probably over now, at least it's foundering really badly. Things had started to go toxic for a while I think.
It's one of those relationships where no matter how positive you try to be and how you go out of your way not to be offensive to the other person, you know there's something nasty brewing beneath the surface there and they're waiting to hate you for some small miss-heard thing, a facial expression, or tone of voice, that there's no way to apologise for.
Very toxic. :(

It's a shame, we got on well when we did, and even with the toxic stuff we could still make it work but throwing alcohol into the mix is too much. She can't handle her drink- the frontal lobe stops its fact checking and reason, all inhibition is dulled down and her mind becomes totally ruled by negative emotion and impulse. Her intelligence is completely unhampered by it though; so this isn't just the usual aggressive drunk person, she's full on Romulan XD
(ie. smart, but without the cold logic and emotional inhibition of the Vulcans)

Alcohol tends to, essentially, whittle away people's fuses. Their tempers become quick and explosive. It usually exacerbates anxiety significantly. So whatever other mental and emotional issues they may be wrestling with, alcohol just makes most all of it that much worse.

It's not a good long-term solution for anything. We joke about it, but it really only tends to make most people worse at everything, especially where they're emotionally concerned.

It's not easy to put one's foot down and say it, but not all substances are right for all people, and living with someone or even just spending extensive time with someone who is becoming increasingly toxic – largely due to that substance they overindulge in – becomes untenable. They will have to make a decision as to what means more to them and what actually helps them. But unfortunately, plenty of people will in desperation grasp for the alcohol, not the person helping them who cares about them.

But you have to decide for yourself and your own safety. Someone who has actually presented a lethal threat to you? Don't let the door hit you. Get the hell out of there!

@Oz- if you feel it is toxic at this point, there are two options:

1 - You can try to save it for the best of your ability, for what it is worth, relationships that are worth having are few and far between

or

2 - take her car on an off-road trip completely destroying the grip on the wheels and coast down several really steep mountains numerous times while overusing the brake so they overheat, then throw water all over them so they rust. This automatically guarantees the end of a relationship, and she will spend months having to work and pay off car repairs, therefore having to think about you the whole time.

hushicho wrote:
Alcohol tends to, essentially, whittle away people's fuses. Their tempers become quick and explosive. It usually exacerbates anxiety significantly. So whatever other mental and emotional issues they may be wrestling with, alcohol just makes most all of it that much worse.

Exactly.
Everything you say.

kawaiidaigakusei wrote:
…take her car on an off-road trip completely destroying the grip on the wheels and coast down several really steep mountains numerous times while overusing the brake so they overheat, then throw water all over them so they rust. This automatically guarantees the end of a relationship, and she will spend months having to work and pay off car repairs, therefore having to think about you the whole time.

HA! Sounds like you're talking from experience!

Yes!! Never trust a person with the keys to your car if one of their favorite things to do is off-roading.

Remember the old adage: The only person you can really trust is yourself.

johnstro12 wrote:
An alcohol use disorder, however, could quickly ruin your relationship.

…or slowly, as in my case. My wife always “liked a drop” and in our early years, was a sexy and fun drunk. There's a large genetic component to alcoholism, with about 20% susceptible to it. Her father was.
“Nice as pie” when he was sober, but as mean as a shithouse rat when not.
She got worse as she got older, and eventually got abusive to me, unfortunately coinciding with me becoming ill with the onset of kidney failure. She retired early, but went full-on cray with it, whereas previously she had been a “functioning alcoholic”. I even had friends of hers tell me they were amazed at the things she would say to me, in their presence. Until I saw some government vids on domestic abuse on T.V., it hadn't iccurred tome that I was a victim - I guess because it crept up in me,over time.
She decided to get a “granny cabin” on my daughter and s-i-l's ‘hobby farm’, about 2.5 hours away. It took about 8 months before she finally moved up there, during which I was very stressed out. I thought she'd improve, being up there with our grand-daughters, but sadly not.
Eventually my daughter and hubby got her into re-hab., and she's been ‘dry’ for about 18 months, while I've had a few years of peace and quiet.
Her older sister and 2 younger brothers didn't become alcoholics.
My daughter certainly isn't, although my son's been a heavy drinker, but has been curbing it, lately.
Just unlucky I guess…. it's upsetting when someone says they've “wasted their life” with you, and leaves you wondering a huge “what if”, about a previous ‘ex-’, who had wanted me back, and kept calling to find out if we'd broken up, for a couple of years !
Anyway, we've all got our ‘crosses’ to bear, eh ? B-)

johnstro12 wrote:
An alcohol use disorder, however, could quickly ruin your relationship.

Yes. It's sad…
It puts me in a weird position too. When I see her pouring a glass of wine or vodka I just cringe… I don't want to be controlling of count her drinks but at the same time I don't think she always keeps track of it herself and the memory of what she can be like scares me.

BearinOz wrote:
I even had friends of hers tell me they were amazed at the things she would say to me, in their presence.

Yup, that happened when we were at a friends place for dinner. It was awful but it was good to have a outside party confirm this was really happening.

We're still limping along in our relationship…
I'm sad for your experience man. It's very enlightening though!

————

I'm not a fan of any substance abuse. But I'm all for allowing people freedom to use anything safely.

It's just that people always think they're more fun to be around when they're drunk or drugged, but they never are.
- I mean, sure, get a light buzz on from a couple of drinks or whatever, but when you're actually impaired and not functioning normally (this includes pot), you're not interesting. You become 100% a burden to people around you and a bore at best. At worst you're dangerous and we wish you'd just go.

This bothers me about the massive pro- drug message in a lot of TV shows and movies these days. They should have the freedom to show they as long as they show the bad side too. This message of “do drugs, it's fun!”, and “the drugged people are the cool ones” annoys me. It's like these idiot writers have never experienced real life.

ozoneocean wrote:

BearinOz wrote:
I even had friends of hers tell me they were amazed at the things she would say to me, in their presence.

Yup, that happened when we were at a friends place for dinner. It was awful but it was good to have a outside party confirm this was really happening.

We're still limping along in our relationship…
I'm sad for your experience man. It's very enlightening though!

————

Don't let it become a permanent limp.
Look after #1 - It sounds callous, and sometimes it gets too late, but if your own life becomes misery, you'll be little use to others.

On an another note - maybe I was just lucky, but only a few of my old surfing mates became a pain-in-the-arse through alcohol (and tended to become unmates and drift away) and none at all from the old Morocco Gold or Afghan Black.
I've always felt liberal and tolerant, but ‘hard stuff’ users who steal and hurt others have become a real societal pain and restricting access isn't the answer…and I don't have one either.

ozoneocean wrote:

It's just that people always think they're more fun to be around when they're drunk or drugged, but they never are.
- I mean, sure, get a light buzz on from a couple of drinks or whatever, but when you're actually impaired and not functioning normally (this includes pot), you're not interesting. You become 100% a burden to people around you and a bore at best. At worst you're dangerous and we wish you'd just go.

This bothers me about the massive pro- drug message in a lot of TV shows and movies these days. They should have the freedom to show they as long as they show the bad side too. This message of “do drugs, it's fun!”, and “the drugged people are the cool ones” annoys me. It's like these idiot writers have never experienced real life.

Where I come from it was a massive drinking culture growing up. In our late teens we were all out getting smashed at weekends but looking back, you could already tell who was going to develop a drink problem. We had no idea of course. They were just the ones who always said/did something outrageous and had to be carried home at the end of the night. Then there were the strange older sisters or brothers who'd also be hanging around the same scene. We didn't realise they were already lost to drink and/or drugs either.

—

The UK now appears to be a mass experiment in herd immunity. The government say they are following the best advice of the scientists. When it all goes horribly wrong, they will blame the bad advice of the scientists.

The Covid-19 stuff is a bit scary now…
Of course it all all blow over and not be an issue in a few weeks or months and we'll wonder why we were even worried to begin with, but right now I think it's ok to be concerned.

I think I'd be ok if I caught it. I'm not a big robust guy though so I might struggle a bit. What I'm more worried about is my parents who are older and older friends I know.

The nasty thing about Covid-19 is that it's more infectious than the normal flu and often leads directly to viral pneumonia. That's the important thing!

Normally flu messes with your lungs, weakens your immune system and makes you susceptible to a bacterial infection in the lungs that can give you pneumonia. That's bad and can lead to fatality, but at least we can fight it with all sorts of antibiotics.
You can't fight viruses that way though. And there's no vaccine to Covid-19 yet, so once you have viral pneumonia from it there's nothing you can do except wait for your immune system to slowly weather it and clean it up.
And if your immune system is already compromised or your lungs are weak or whatever, then you better be careful :(

ozoneocean wrote:


The nasty thing about Covid-19 is that it's more infectious than the normal flu and often leads directly to viral pneumonia. That's the important thing!

Normally flu messes with your lungs, weakens your immune system and makes you susceptible to a bacterial infection in the lungs that can give you pneumonia. That's bad and can lead to fatality, but at least we can fight it with all sorts of antibiotics.
You can't fight viruses that way though. And there's no vaccine to Covid-19 yet, so once you have viral pneumonia from it there's nothing you can do except wait for your immune system to slowly weather it and clean it up.
And if your immune system is already compromised or your lungs are weak or whatever, then you better be careful :(

Yes, 4 and 5 years ago I had flu that lead to pneumonia and 2-3 weeks in hospital each time, touch & go and on oxygen continuously…
I'm 71, as of last Thursday, a life-long asthmatic and post-transplant, “strike 3” for me ! B-)

In the #theresalwaysabrightside dept. - now half the planet is on lockdown, new pages should be being created at a prolific rate, with a huge upturn in posting frequency ! B-)

I've been following what's been going on with COVID-19 lately, and I'm not going to lie: despite my dad being in a VA home right now, the virus itself doesn't scare me. It's the reaction and “solution” that's been keeping me on edge lately.

I've been having some sleepless nights as a result. I'm concerned about these lockdowns becoming a more permanent thing. That or, if this does blow over, it becomes a precedent into how much we can give up to the state. I find it a little creepy that US state governors can tell private business owners when or if they can stay open. I think a bar or a restaurant can make the decision about whether to stay open or not during this crisis themselves, and not have to be forced to by a government official.

I don't want to sound inflammatory posting this. I ended up in a huge argument on the Comicfury forums yesterday because of this same topic. The fact of the matter is that I am really scared right now. I have been slipping into a deep depression lately, verging suicidal, just wondering when or if I'm ever going to see my dad or anyone else in person ever again. He's 87 years old and while in okay health, at that age he could go any time. I've made the effort to go and visit him at least once a week for over a year as a result. I hate the idea of living through another great depression (my dad was born in the middle of that, it was not fun) or in a world without any freedom left. It's the only thing I have left.

I THINK THAT EVER SINCE this outbreak broke out, all these solutions went from okay, to stupid, to down right authoritarian.

I am literally the most progressive, liberal person as much as everyone else, but shutting down the planet is completely scary. Not to mention of a potential economic collapse.

The rise of totalitarianism is literally the most scariest part of it all. The United States, with its VAST resources could have prepared for this. But nope, lets fire the Pandemic Team over at the CDC because nothing bad will happen right?

elektro wrote:
I find it a little creepy that US state governors can tell private business owners when or if they can stay open. I think a bar or a restaurant can make the decision about whether to stay open or not during this crisis themselves, and not have to be forced to by a government official.

During the Blitz, British people were told by government officials to black out their windows, so the Luftwaffe could not aim at lights on the ground. Nobody was allowed to make their own decision on the matter. Around 32,000 people died in the Blitz.

With a total lockdown, there's a chance of keeping UK coronavirus deaths below 250,000. Without it you can double that.

There's already a longstanding precedent for chief executives – state governors as well as presidents – implementing draconian measures in times of disaster or emergency. It's nothing new, and you shouldn't be worried about it.

I have to admit, while I haven't looked into exactly how this “herd immunity” thing is being implemented in the UK, it does strike me as an intriguing option. If the outbreak doesn't provide us a (temporary) respite in the coming spring and summer, then the only path back to normalcy is once enough people are immunized that the virus can no longer readily spread person-to-person. Immunization would come from a vaccine – months away at best – or through exposure. Exposing enough low risk people to the virus sounds like a sensible way of building up enough community immunity to blunt the worst of it without overloading the medical system. And if you have enough medical resources on hand to deal with the relatively few serious cases, then you can drastically bring down mortality rates even among high risk populations. It's a scary idea, but I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a bad idea. And it's the only plan I see with a discernible endgame.

The “herd immunity” idea as the UK government is playing with it is bad and good science doesn't support it. It means the death toll can be a lot bigger.

The trouble is that no one alive today has lived through a pandemic like this so we don't think it's a big deal and we see the solutions , like lockdowns, as the real problem… When it's not.

This is basically the type of plauge that killed so many in the past that we read about in history books:
Not fatal enough that transmission to a much greater number of people is possible. The more people that get it the more change of a bigger death toll.

If you're young and healthy you will probably be ok, if you're old or have a compromised immune system you will probably die because there's nothing that can be done. There's no cure, vaccine, antidote or treatment. Nothing that can fight the virus except your own body and contrary to alt health people and conartists, there's both ng That will “boost your immune system” :(

We have been down this road at least twice in the past ten years. SARS, H1N1 were both pandemics like this. That the resources and planning weren't in place is so many people's fault in and out of government.

We knew it was a matter of time before something like this happened again our efforts were found wanting. But fortunately though this is a very communicable illness it is not a particularly lethal one. Between 3 to 0.7% won't be anything like the plagues of old where death rates were 20% and up. And we're all reacting like it's the pneumonic plague where the death rate is 50% and up.

This is not that. There's still research to be done but following the example of South Korea is pretty much our best bet. Test, test and test, isolate the infected and keep going. However large mobile populations just won't sit still and some governments are slow to mobilize even though they have seen like before. A lot of the self quarantine and shutdown is based on the actions taken with Spanish flu 100 years ago where it was crowds celebrating Armistice that spread it so quickly. But that had a 25% mortality rate. Studies indicate that even today Spanish Flu would be upwards of 15% lethal not 0.7 let alone 3%.

But facts don't matter in the face of hysteria.

And you know how to boost your immune system? What doctors say you should already be doing. Eat right and remain active.

Now excuse me I have to wipe down some frequently used surfaces and wash my hands again.

It seems impossible to draw accurate conclusions about the mortality rate of Spanish Flu due to the lack of data. The 25% you mentioned is the highest I've seen. Others make a case for it being as low as 2%. As for herd immunity, the UK government seems to have abandoned that theoretical approach very quickly in the face of rapidly developing circumstances. I expect we'll be in line with other European countries within days, maybe hours. Schools are still open but an announcement is expected later today.

I don't think that's hysteria. The measure of any society is how it cares for it's most vulnerable members, so if people are willing to put their own lives on hold to achieve that, so much the better. Maybe we will all emerge from our quarantine just a little bit less divided.

Bogroll stockpiling on the other hand, that's definitely mass hysteria. Or possibly mass diarrhoea.

There are a lot of con-artists rising too. Especially when it comes to this pandemic.

With the “flattening the curve” articles lots of examples and data are quoted from public health records of 1917-20. The US kept decent data in urban areas at the time. Many cities had been through plenty of serious epidemics and had a fairly modern approach. One city canceled all the Armistice celebrations and urged self quarantine another had their celebration. A 2-3% rate of death versus 15-20% resulted.

I've already seen people with cloves of garlic in their pockets, just like my grandmother told me they did in 1919.

I'm on vacation but I'm back to work next week because I'm an essential worker being security in petroleum distribution. But I work outside and have a stick to measure proper safe distance. I also have a persistent dry cough because of my high blood pressure medication. I've also had a couple of 24 hour bugs so I'm alert to any personal health concerns.

I have had to take a bunch of online courses about pandemics and precautions because of my job so I'm not going into this totally talking out of my rear. It's freaking part of my job. Also had a bit of public health training back in the National Guard.

I already dealt with one of the previous scares back when I worked security in a senior residence. I'm thankful I don't have to deal with that kind of lockdown this time around.

Happy new year to everyone here at the Duck. May you all be happy, healthy, and prosperous. We are definitely living in interesting times, and we need to learn some new tricks to living safely. Fortunately, drawing and posting here on the Duck is the ultimate in “Social Distancing”. ;-) All the best.

— Rick Rudge

SARS, H1N1 and the rest are certainly nothing like the situation now. Both were nasty flus but this one has caused world wide panic and shutdowns. Neither of those did that. CoVid-19 is the only pandemic in living memory that has caused this kind of global social and economic impact. There's no need to down-play it.

It's more like the plagues of old in the social impact and the global nature of it. Not the death toll because we have way better education, sanitation, testing, more advanced medical services, and just way better systems in place at every level to deal with it than we have at any time in the past.
Things like Ebola were fare deadlier and that barely made it out of Africa. If many of the plagues from the past struck today they probably wouldn't make much of a dent at all.

I mean- no people on the streets, cancelled events, shortages in shops world wide, people being forced to go on leave from work…
Looks like I'll be forced to go on leave as well, and maybe the business I work for won't survive and I'll have to find another job.

This is a very interesting time. I hope this sort of thing won't happen again.

Downplaying a tragedy like this is part of coping. You think of the worst that has happened in the past, compare this to that and realize it's not that bad and you can deal with it.

It's how I've come to deal with my lifelong tendency of catastrophizing and being completely overwhelmed.

I take it apart and deal with it. What do I have to do, what can I do and I do it.

Even with modern sanitation and medicine if pneumonic plague got going you'd still see a high death toll. Septicemic plague moves so fast that treatments have to begin within hours. And even with modern everything bubonic plague still will kill 15-20% of all infected.

And if the anti-vaxers have their way we'll be back to the bad old days of epidemics that make this look like a holiday jaunt to Canterbury. That's what Chaucer was writing about. A trip through the clean countryside to social distance from the black death in the city.