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Disturbing news
bravo1102 at 4:55AM, March 9, 2022
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I was just perusing the Bad Webcomic Wiki and looked under a forum topic. “What makes a bad webcomic?”

And one of the criteria is “hosting on a site like Drunkduck”

The site has no standards. Like anyone can post here so everything here by definition is bad. It is so tempting to give this useless feces flinging simian a good drill sergeant tongue lashing but pretentious “I'm so much cooler than thou” types only deserve to be ignored as the under the bridge dwellers they are.

Though when I do meet one in person well that's what anger management is for or else any con I went to would be the scene of a mass murder. Not really. Usually my eyes hurt bad from rolling them all day – and my sides hurt from laughing so hard 不
Ozoneocean at 5:36AM, March 9, 2022
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LOL

I think we've proven conclusively that we're the cool ones in the equation.

While they're all sweating blood trying Sooooooooo very hard to follow the crowd and copy what they THINK is popular and what will give them the most views, imitating art styles, story-lines, even getting the same software and hardware and using the same techniques… we're here just doing our job,being a rock solid reliable host for actual creators who love creating, for actual ARTISTS.

We don't give two craps for the posers and try-hards, the wannabees, the imitators… All the pathetic Scrappy-Doos of the internet. XD

This is a 20 year old webcomic host that cares about its members.
I would bet real money that most of the webcomic sites the losers who wrote that blog used died a long time ago and their comics have vanished off the face of the earth.

Or else they're using the BurgerKing sites like Webtoons and Tapass and imagining they understand anything about webcomiccing… Pah-leeeese… It's like a 13 year old trying to tell you what's cool and what's not.
 
Andreas_Helixfinger at 6:19AM, March 9, 2022
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I just went to check up on the site. The only thing I've read on The Bad Webcomics Wiki was the article about Sonichu and that was back in like 2015 or something. I don't think I've actually navigated the site, I'm trying it now and I'm like: Seriously!!! I'm opening up one of their article lists and it's like a grey-white square with title links that are this beige, yellow color that blends into the box. I have to squint to see what it says on each title.

So my reply to that criteria is “if you're going to list an entire website as the criteria for bad anything, maybe you shouldn't have a crappier, harder to navigate home website then said website”不不不

last edited on March 9, 2022 6:35AM
Amelius at 12:44PM, March 9, 2022
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Nothing they say matters, I wouldn't give them the justification of looking at their garbage website, it only benefits them in the end. It's a trap.

This guy here sums them up perfectly.

There's no point in engaging in it or fighting against it. These are genuinely some of the dumbest people on the internet, if you yell at them they're only going to get a boner over it because getting people mad is what they wanted. If they really cared about webcomic authors putting quality in their work they'd bother to put quality in their reviews. It's all about outrage farming.

I can't get too offended, these people can't even read, it's like getting insulted by a baby.
Genejoke at 4:20PM, March 9, 2022
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The site has no standards. Like anyone can post here so everything here by definition is bad.

So by their definition everything on the internet is bad… who knew.
lothar at 4:27PM, March 9, 2022
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I stay because DD is one of the last vestiges of the original free internet
sleeping_gorilla at 4:42PM, March 9, 2022
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Andreas_Helixfinger wrote:
I just went to check up on the site. The only thing I've read on The Bad Webcomics Wiki was the article about Sonichu and that was back in like 2015 or something. I don't think I've actually navigated the site, I'm trying it now and I'm like: Seriously!!! I'm opening up one of their article lists and it's like a grey-white square with title links that are this beige, yellow color that blends into the box. I have to squint to see what it says on each title.

So my reply to that criteria is “if you're going to list an entire website as the criteria for bad anything, maybe you shouldn't have a crappier, harder to navigate home website than said website”不不不


Forgive me for sucking up. The fact that DD hosts comics like Molly Lusc demolishes the argument that DD only hosts bad comics. Just look at the featured section and you'll quickly find some of the best webcomics on the internet. Have they even seen Pinky TA, Team 541, Tusk, Wrota Metro, or Charby the Vampirate?
Amelius at 8:34PM, March 9, 2022
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I can assure you with 100% certainty they are aware of those comics, shocking I know considering they seem barely cognizant of their surroundings, but they almost certainly have cringey little articles about every one of ‘em, all lacking nuance, reading comprehension or even basic understanding of media criticism, as is their wont.

I was listening to Faith No More and reading youtube comments praising Mike Patton’s amazing vocal range, and some idiot commented “I think his vocal range is crap”. This is similar to the quality of person doing the reviews there, someone who doesn't know jack about media crit, just likes to be contrarian, and thinks their opinion is objective fact and most of all, that people who are enjoying something NEED to hear their negative opinion.

That is to say, Patton's vocal range isn't up for debate, it's whether you like his voice or not. Much like rando idiot youtubers, these guys don't have even the basic understanding of how to review. Bless their stupid little hearts they do it anyway, and they all read like 13 year olds half-@s$ing a book report for a novel they stopped reading halfway through and rushed to finish the night before it was due.

I know far better comics than mine that have been absolutely trashed by their ilk. It's not about quality, you could serve them the most exquisite meal they ever had and they'd gag because they swear they taste cilantro (in a dish where there's no cilantro) the way they FEEL about it is more important than what's actually being served to them.

(Though, thanks for the kind words mentioning mine, sleeping_gorilla, I'm a little awkward of being held up as an example of a “good” comic here though haha! Puts a bit of a target on me because without even reading a single review, I KNOW they think my comic is garbage. People I used to look up to on this very site were SUPER CONDESCENDING to me because they thought my comic was garbage and undeserving of attention, and I wouldn't be shocked if those people went on to contribute there. The lack of reading comprehension certainly checks out.)


last edited on March 9, 2022 8:36PM
sleeping_gorilla at 9:54PM, March 9, 2022
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@Amelius I swear I didn't realize you were commented on this thread. I just quickly skimmed the main page for examples. I consider your comic to be a staple of DD as it's been around for as long as I can remember, and has always been of high quality. Just as you said, there are many comics here that are empirically good…

…and then there's mine. :|
Amelius at 11:49PM, March 9, 2022
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Haha, no worries! I lurk more than I post, it's the anxiety.
I appreciated the mention, it's a nice change of pace from when people only brought up my comic to complain like I'm some evil mastermind who is ruining the site by existing.

Aaaay and no need to put yourself down, I know I'm inclined toward a bit of self-deprecation (I try to cull it before I post it though haha) but that stuff'll lead you to an unhealthy spiral.

I'd be a hypocrite to say don't compare yourself to others though I do that a LOT, I see comics that get praised up and down and they're so different from mine, I begin to feel like what I'm doing isn't worth anyone's time and I'm letting my readers down because I'm not as good as *points* that comic over there. But I think this person's comic summed it up best:

bravo1102 at 1:21AM, March 10, 2022
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Hold on, self depreciation is my trademarked shtick. Anyone else needs my written permission to call their stuff garbage and my attorneys tell me there were no requests.

You see folks, yes even one of the most read and respected creators on this site calls their work garbage. Self-doubt happens to everyone. You can use it to make yourself a better creator or even person, but please don't use it to make yourself miserable.

Thanks Amelius for saying it much better than I could.

Genejoke at 2:52AM, March 10, 2022
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A couple of sayings spring to mind, one involves opinions and assholes, the other trash and treasure. Also you have to remember the wise words of The Offspring, it's ccol to hate!

The great thing about this site is that anyone can post pretty much anything; again that trash and treasure thing comes to mind. Creativity isn't always about quality or professionalism, in fact I'd say such things can stifle creativity. So maybe yeah some stuff here is bad, who cares there's a lot of great comics, niche comics, diamonds in the rough and comics that have hidden depth and quality. None of that would happen without the freedom creators have here.
Andreas_Helixfinger at 3:32AM, March 10, 2022
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Honestly, I feel like doing some self-deprication has helped me shred off all of these pretentions and delusions that I've had regarding my stories. I used to have this serious case of the chosen one syndrome regarding my writing at one point. I tricked myself to think that there was some kind of hidden, special juice going on with my storytelling. Ridicolous. Not that I think my comics are bad, I still think their good, or will be good someday. But they're not “special”, at least not to anyone but me:P

And I've ALWAYS compared what I've been doing to all these bigger, out there in the know franchises, thinking what I was doing was somehow comparable to that, or should be comparable to that. And I confessed all this out in the open on Discord recently, and funny thing, doing that I feel helped my brain proparly adjust to gravity. I'm an amateur and I always will be. As in the french meaning of amateur which means doing something because you love it.

I do this because I love it and that's it. That's all I need. I'm so, so greatful for having an audience, for having people to share what I love with, and to be in the company of creators who produces content they love that I love. It's like Bravo always says “Do what you love and love what you do”.

Will I still compare my work to other's from time to time? Probably. But I think it will be easier to remind myself that they're not me, I'm not them. I don't have to be the next Alan Moore for my content to be worth a damn. I can never, ever do what Alan Moore does, or what Thomas Ligotti does, or what Lorne Lanning does, or whoever else, and it has never really been what I've been doing anyway. I can only be Andreas Helixfinger for whatever it's worth, and that's okay.

I do too appreciate your mention of my comic sleeping_gorilla! I really do have to pay your comics a visit sometime and see it with my own eyes.
last edited on March 10, 2022 4:00AM
Ironscarf at 4:40AM, March 10, 2022
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This attitude is fairly standard fare. I heard Brad Guigar on the Comic lab podcast describe posting on the Duck and I think Comic Fury too as ‘guilt by association’. He was a lot less dismissive of Tapas and especially Webtoons, even though to the best of my knowledge anyone can post on those sites too. The only difference is they don't allow adult content, but his own comic is adult content.

I would love to be shredded on the Bad Web comics Wiki one day, almost a badge of honour, but it wouldn't have the cache it one did. The site does feel like a relic of a bygone era, relating to the pre social media dark ages and I'm sure they would say the same about us.
 
last edited on March 10, 2022 4:42AM
Furwerk studio at 5:51AM, March 10, 2022
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The “Bad webcomic wiki” feels like the Linkara for the webcomic world, a caustic critic that is following the fads, only seemingly praise the popular company while damning nearly everything else, even with faint praise. Hell, a very narrow view in those companies.

And to be honest those “good” comics feel, the same. They all feel like ultra clean and sterile to a fine point like it came from a pile of clipart from the same artist with just a limerick structure. You know, there is was a _____ who lived in _____, who had a ______ so long..

Anyway, I rather try to to be different, weird and bad then bland and “good” in the eyes of webcomic Linkara.

[EDIT: I would like to add I noticed Tapas and Webtoon creators are a bit afraid to experiment or try anything different, and I don't just mean visual wise but also with setting, themes or genre.

I'm working on a project, trying to get a years worth of material together before posting, but it is going to be an EC styled anthology that feature toon furries. I've seen other artists on site use 3D models to great effect, and playing with art styles ranging from kid cartoon to superheroic, and the sub-styles within them, it super neat!]
last edited on March 10, 2022 6:15AM
bravo1102 at 6:20AM, March 10, 2022
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I've tried Webtoons and Tapas but it's just a vindication of the 85% rule. Pretty much everything there is “same comic different title” copy and paste situations and characters mined from TVtropes.

To explain my version of the 85% rule.
85% of everything is garbage.
85% of people can't tell garbage from good.
85% of people think they're in the 15% that is good and able to tell crap from quality.
And the 15% alternate between forehead slaps, rolling eyes and rolling in the aisles in laughter.
Furwerk studio at 6:55AM, March 10, 2022
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You got that “copy paste” part right, I just popped over in raw curiosity and it felt like every single comic was drawn by the same computer algorithm and program, and also written by them. It is the same problem I have with Marvel/DC, everything looks and reads exactly the same, and none of it is even “so bad it's interesting” level like early Image, they just mechanically flawless but completely dull to actually read.
Ozoneocean at 6:56AM, March 10, 2022
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Amelius wrote:

LOL! I remember when Charby was the big bad of DD because it was always number 1 and never shifted XD
But you were always the very embodiment of grace no matter what. That was pretty amazing.


I sway between massive self aggrandizement and self congratulation… and utterly despising my work and thinking it's low and garbage. I continually bounce between those states for all my creations, whether it's comics, paintings, sewing, sculpture or whatever.
I think that's pretty typical though?
 
Andreas_Helixfinger at 7:25AM, March 10, 2022
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Ozoneocean wrote:

LOL! I remember when Charby was the big bad of DD because it was always number 1 and never shifted XD
But you were always the very embodiment of grace no matter what. That was pretty amazing.


I sway between massive self aggrandizement and self congratulation… and utterly despising my work and thinking it's low and garbage. I continually bounce between those states for all my creations, whether it's comics, paintings, sewing, sculpture or whatever.
I think that's pretty typical though?

It always gotta be this pendelum swinging for us all, doesn't it? Narcissism on one far end and inferiority-complex on the other far end. I wanna think that I've made my own pendelum swing a little bit lighter. But that could be me tricking myself again:P
Wildcat Arren at 8:43AM, March 10, 2022
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bravo1102 wrote:

The site has no standards. Like anyone can post here


This is why I like this website. I'm a big fan of this freedom of expression thing. I had some unpleasant experience with people who want standards and “standards” in their minds was “only things I like are allowed”

I also had this feeling of same comic, different title when it comes to Tapas. It's natural that when you like something, you will copy it in some way, but a creator should evolve and after a while develop his unique style. A lot of things I saw there gave me this feeling that creators were more interested in doing the current popular thing more that in saying or shwing something personal.

Also, when it comes to creating comic as a single person, creator is very unlikely to be perfect in every way. You can have great idea for a story and have understanting how to do it in a comic, but your art can be far from good. The example I can give is ONE, creator of One-Punch Man and Mob Psycho 100 - great characters and stories, but not really that great when it comes to drawing by himself.
last edited on March 10, 2022 8:53AM
Call Me Tom at 9:18AM, March 10, 2022
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I'll be honest I'm surprised they BWW is still a thing!
I'm sorry for any offence I cause.
Andreas_Helixfinger at 10:11AM, March 10, 2022
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Call Me Tom wrote:
I'll be honest I'm surprised they BWW is still a thing!

I imagine the articlers on BWW reading this forum thread and they themselves being surprised they're still a thing^^
sleeping_gorilla at 12:35PM, March 10, 2022
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Andreas_Helixfinger wrote:
I do too appreciate your mention of my comic sleeping_gorilla! I really do have to pay your comics a visit sometime and see it with my own eyes.

When we were doing the Halloween and Christmas events I checked out a lot of Molly Lusc to get a feel for the character. I liked the concept, kind of a post-apocalyptic noir starring aquatic furries, and art. Particularly loved Molly herself, she's an endearing protagonist.
Andreas_Helixfinger at 3:30PM, March 10, 2022
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sleeping_gorilla wrote:

When we were doing the Halloween and Christmas events I checked out a lot of Molly Lusc to get a feel for the character. I liked the concept, kind of a post-apocalyptic noir starring aquatic furries, and art. Particularly loved Molly herself, she's an endearing protagonist.

Glads me very much to hear^^ Yeah, I remember you commented on the comic once saying you thought it was excellent:) Been doing a bit of tinkering with the setting lately. I changed it from a global post-apocalypse into a regional post-apocalypse and made the island and town that the story takes place on part of an english-speaking nation of islands outside the northwest coast of Africa.

And so I switched out the Chernobyl disaster for a local nuclear power plant disaster that took place on one of these islands. These changes comes out in the monolouge text, so no change in terms of visuals except the very first panel. But yeah, Molly herself I knew was going to be the most appealing part of the comic.

She's a very dear character of mine. Being this anti-heroine who will do some questionable things and still manage to be lovable at the end of the day. She can be selfish, but still has a lot of empathy for other people. She can be slick and smooth, but can also be weird and awkward. Both very humorous and very serious of a personality, all very charming. I'm going to get to the end of the first story arc, picking it up next week, so we can got to our next adventure with the quick-flippered femme fatale^^
last edited on March 10, 2022 3:32PM
fallopiancrusader at 1:47PM, March 11, 2022
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I think theyre still active, because they recently posted a review of Trumped by Rawdale, which appears on this site. I go to BWW periodically just to check if either of my webcomics have been inducted into that august roster yet. But, alas, I have so far been disappointed.
Andreas_Helixfinger at 2:42AM, March 12, 2022
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fallopiancrusader wrote:
I think theyre still active, because they recently posted a review of Trumped by Rawdale, which appears on this site. I go to BWW periodically just to check if either of my webcomics have been inducted into that august roster yet. But, alas, I have so far been disappointed.

I have to admit, like you and Ironscarf, I wouldn't mind it at all if any of my webcomics were given a royal BWW beatdown. It would be a boost and a laugh to see even if it would do very little, if anything at all, in terms of exposure.
last edited on March 12, 2022 2:43AM
Ozoneocean at 7:51AM, March 14, 2022
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The Quackcast tomorrow is on this VERY subject! Don't forget to listen :D


There's actually a massive hidden benefit to being mentioned on a site like that. It means you're visible and people will look for you. Even better if there's a direct link.
No such thing as bad publicity they say… All links and mentions count on the web.
 
bravo1102 at 8:33AM, March 15, 2022
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I should note that Robofemoids has a South Korean FB fan page and mentions off site on a German science fiction site. Battle of the Robofemoids was briefly highlighted in a blog off site as having amazing visuals but one of the sickest plots and most graphic violence the blogger had seen. He figured it was so sick as to be some sort of parody but a hard read unless you liked that sort of weird sick stuff.

So I doubt the guys (I know it's mostly male) at BWW would ever consider my webcomics regardless due to their unabashed weirdness and subtly irreverent tone. So they might actually think my crap knows its bad, revels in its awfulness so doesn't need to be singled out as bad.
Andreas_Helixfinger at 2:59AM, March 16, 2022
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To paraphrase Tony “Scarface” Montana:
They need people like us! They need people like us so they can point their fu**ing fingers and say “that's the bad webcomickers!” So what does that make them? Good? They're not good! They just know how to hide–and lie! We–we don't have that problem! WE–we always tell the truth even when we lie! SO SAY GOODNIGHT TO THE BAD WEBCOMICKERS!!! Go on!! It'll be the last time you people out there of the internet are ever gonna see bad webcomickers like this again, let me tell ya'!不不不
last edited on March 16, 2022 3:48AM
PaulEberhardt at 7:27AM, March 16, 2022
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“Malis displicere laudari est.” - “To displease bad people is to be praised.”

This quote referred to a justly forgotten “Bad Marble Relief” rostrum in the corner of some shady Ancient Roman forum for all I know. It immediately pops up in my mind whenever I see stuck-up twits at work like those in that very fine example that bravo spotted floating up from the cesspool of pointless wikis. I don't think it was written by thirteen-year olds, though, because with those many thirteen-year olds I know personally there's at least some faint hope that they'll grow out of it some day.

Always happy to be in a community that displeases these guys, that's all I can say.
last edited on March 16, 2022 7:29AM

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