General Discussion

Rant, moan, rave and share - for all your chatter, natter, ETCETERA!
Lonnehart at 10:46PM, Feb. 21, 2012
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Great…. last time my tire went flat I brought it in for repair.  It went flat because it got nailed.  Today it goes flat AGAIN.  Why?  Because this time it got SCREWED!!!  Of course I don't have it as bad as one Statesider (someone who originates/lives in the mainland U.S.) the repair guy told me about.  He had a ratchet extension puncture his tire and ruin the rim it was on too.  I'd love to know how he managed that…  Also I…
 
*can't say anymore as he's attacked and devoured by several random zombified DDers…*
bravo1102 at 6:34AM, Feb. 22, 2012
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Punctures on the tread are no big deal.  It's when you shred the tire after going over all kinds of weird stuff under two feet of snow that really gets me.  What did they do sow tire spikes all over the road with the sand and salt mixture?
 
When I worked in a service station the hardest part often was finding where the nail/screw had gone in and then there was the mechanic who forgot to bolt the wheel back to the car.  Off the car drove and within 30 feet the wheel and tire came off and *CRASH* *GRIND* Messed up the whole axle.  But the tire and rim were fine.
 
So the wifie was nagging me to go to bed yesterday because I was up late doing playing some games I discovered on line. (2PM, working nights I keep exactly opposite hours from most people.  Maybe I'm on European time or something)  “They might call you in!” 
 
Wouldn't you know they did.  I forgot the regular overnight guy always calls out on Ash Wednesday.  Three years in row now.
Ironscarf at 6:39AM, Feb. 22, 2012
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Hippie Van wrote:      
    It's also entirely possible that I'm just retarded and never sent it. Actually, that seems most likely. —   
Well it's definitely the thought that counts anyway so thanks for those lovely unexpressed sentiments! :)
And since PQs can't be trusted, here is my sincerely held reply to your imagined post:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=051_taCenfU&feature=related
 
 
last edited on Feb. 22, 2012 6:42AM
HippieVan at 4:19PM, Feb. 22, 2012
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It's hard living in the middle of nowhere here. There are only two universities I can go to without moving, and they're both really shitty. I don't want to go to either but I'm neither financially nor mentally prepared to move away. And I'm sure I could get into any university in the country with my grades. I don't want to go to a crap university. I also just found out today that because I took one freakin year off to figure out what I wanted to do, I'm not eligible for entrance scholarships. So there's $2000 down the drain.
I don't know, my future isn't looking all that hopeful right now. 
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bravo1102 at 12:22AM, Feb. 23, 2012
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Most people move to go to college.  When I was applying Rutgers was considered a shitty college.  In NJ it is, but everywhere else it's considered quite good.  So “shitty” universities can be a relative thing.  A “shitty” school for one dicipline can be first rate for another one.
Ironscarf at 2:01AM, Feb. 23, 2012
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My advice would be to move, daunting as that may appear. Living away from home for the first time and in a college environment - this is the most freedom you will ever experience in your life.  You can discover the real Hippie, or just do lots of drugs, or both.
 
last edited on Feb. 23, 2012 2:24AM
ozoneocean at 4:30AM, Feb. 23, 2012
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It's important too to not believe the myths about collage/university life too!
-When I finished High School I went straight to a well regarded art school. That was a very free and easy environment where you were treated as a mature adult and indeed there were a lot of much older adult students there and many practising artists.
-I went to university afterwards and that was a very, very stark contrast. It was like being back in highschool. And every uni I've visited has been the same: a much more regulated environment were the students are often quite immature.
 
The thing about a tertiary education is that you are mainly there to get the degree. Getting those qualifications means more than actually learning in most instances, because you could realistically do the learning anywhere (from the net, on the job, whatever)
And the important thing about degrees is that you really have to get post grad stuff if you really want them to carry any weight on your CV. Post grad degrees anywhere tend to mean more than a graduate degree from a prestigious university. So it doesn't matter so much where you go as long as you stick it out long enough. ^_^
 
At leas in my experience…
 
last edited on Feb. 23, 2012 4:32AM
HippieVan at 10:08AM, Feb. 23, 2012
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bravo1102 wrote:
Most people move to go to college.  When I was applying Rutgers was considered a shitty college.  In NJ it is, but everywhere else it's considered quite good.  So “shitty” universities can be a relative thing.  A “shitty” school for one dicipline can be first rate for another one.
Most people don't move to go to university where I live. In places like Ontario they do, because it's only a couple hours by train back to whatever small town they're from. It would be at least a day driving to get to the next good university from where I am.
Our universities here are mandated to be crap, in a way. The provincial government is desperate to keep young people here, and since there are so few choices for post-secondary school, the universities have to accept just about everyone who applies.
 
  
Thank you for the advice, guys. : ) 
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Ironscarf at 3:21PM, Feb. 23, 2012
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ozoneocean wrote:
It's important too to not believe the myths about collage
 
Good collage skills make you attractive to the opposite sex: it pays to know your way around a glue stick.
 
ayesinback at 5:30PM, Feb. 23, 2012
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Ironscarf wrote:
ozoneocean wrote:

“It's important too to not believe the myths about collage”


Good collage skills make you attractive to the opposite sex: it pays to know your way around a glue stick. 
 

XDDD
under new management
HippieVan at 8:55PM, Feb. 23, 2012
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My little sister is pretty clever, although she's mean sometimes. I told her about a lengthy discussion I had with an old man at Festivale about toothbrushes in the days of the voyageurs, and she said “Yeeeeah. And that's why you're not going to get a boyfriend.”
 
Unfortunately I think she's right.
 
Speaking of Festivale, I liked when we all shared stories about our local myths. Let's share more stories in the thread I just started! (I tried to link to it but couldn't figure it out.)
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last edited on Feb. 23, 2012 8:56PM
bravo1102 at 12:12AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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You had the discussion with an old man not a young prospect.  Of course I once met a girl when discussing firepower on the 17th Century battlefield.  She liked how lively and witty I got as I discussed it, not the topic.  It is what the discussion shows about the person not the topic.
 
The sexes usually only interact when they discuss something that interests both of them.  Women usually don't like historical minutae.  So if I ever heard a woman discussing it I'd be right there listening enraptured.  However, I took psychology in college so I know how to make a woman think she's the most interesting person in the room no matter what she's talking about.  Small wonder people seek me out to talk to.  I know how to listen and that is more important than what anyone is talking about.
 
That's the secret; learn how to listen.  People love to discuss what interests them not what you have to say so when someone comes along who shows intense interest in what they have to say, you're ahead of everyone unless a supermodel with a Ph.d walks into the room.  That rare someone who is beautiful and intelligent and well-spoken as opposed to the absolutely gorgeous bubble head. 
ozoneocean at 2:14AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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I don't know if I agree with your Bravo… being a listener isn't that difficult, but it can get quite boring and they will get bored listening to themselves eventually.
 
I find that if someone is being a “listener” to me it makes me feel like a pontificating idiot and I run out of steam. I prefer the give and take of conversation and discussion.
I can have a discussion on pretty much any topic. One sided conversations however are not too enjoyable, from either end.
  
——-
 
@Ironscarf and Ayesinback-
OK, when I went and got my bachelors at the "montage". Yes, life being a student studying at a decoupage is quite different to life outside, you're in your own little world.
 
Genejoke at 3:15AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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The trick to being a good listener is not just hearing but  understanding you need to show you're not only listening but are also interested.  I keep telling my eldest there is a difference between listening and hearing, it's amaing how many adults don't get this.  
Kroatz at 5:12AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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The trick to being a good listener is LISTENING.
 
Duh.
 

 
In other news, the Rhino hasn't been sighted for a while. I guess he's hiding.
 

 
In other, other news, I have many, many hats. But not a lot of news right now. It's not like I've been working on a secret project that will bedazzle and amaze the Duck. I'm not working on a comic or something. I'M NOT ALMOST FINISHED WITH THE FIRST CHAPTER or something. Really.
Comidion.deviantart.com
Genejoke at 7:09AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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The trick to being a good listener is LISTENING.   Duh. 
Prime example of an adult who just doesn't get it.
bravo1102 at 7:49AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Kroatz wrote:
The trick to being a good listener is LISTENING. 
 
Not even close.  As Genejoke said there is a huge difference between being a good listener and just hearing what is said.  There is give and take of conversation as a good listener builds upon the points made by the speaker and shows that what is being said has been heard and understood.  A good listener does not listen to a lecture but repeat back to the speaker what has been heard elucidating on the presented ideas as well as encourage the speaker to continue.
 
Of course the great majority of Humankind who love to hear themselves talk as opposed to actively listening to what is said.  “Enough about me, let's talk about me.  Did you say something?” The listener should make an effort once they start repeating themselves to encourage them to get to the point or even make their point for them.  That really shows you've been listening when you make their conclusion for them. 
 
The big danger of being a listener is of course morphing into a sycophant, toady or lackey.  Becoming someone who agrees with everything that is said and massaging the speaker as opposed to having a conversation.  But then sometimes thats all you can do because there are plenty of egotists out there who will talk about themselves endlessly. 
 
Nah, I'll just lecture because I love the sound of my own voice and just how brilliant a conversationalist I am.  “It is better to say nothing and be thought an idiot than to open your mouth and remove all doubt you are an idiot.”  Therefore I learned how to listen because I have a talent for saying idiotic things. 
ayesinback at 7:54AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Genejoke wrote:
The trick to being a good listener is not just hearing but  understanding you need to show you're not only listening but are also interested.  I keep telling my eldest there is a difference between listening and hearing, it's amaing how many adults don't get this.  
 I think we agree, but I happen to reverse the two words.  Someone who politely sits and listens while I bounce my words off them is listening, but I feel, like Oz where i'm simply lecturing.  On the other hand, someone who actually hears what I'm saying can't help but act engaged.  May not like what they're hearing, or may agree, but my words have penetrated and spurred something inside him/her.
 
And it's not always easy to make yourself able to hear what someone is saying to you because it's necessary to unstuff your own brain to make room for someone else's thoughts. 
 
So I think a “good listener” is someone who succeeds in opening up his/her brain to hear what someone else is saying.
 

 
Oz, I imagine that, all in all, you rather enjoyed your coleaveagiate days
*lazy rim shot*
 

edit:  I hit submit too fast!  
@Hippie, if you can swing it at all, I hope you'll go live on campus at a college/uni.  It can seem daunting at first, but attending college for me was most valuable from the social standpoint – making a new community for myself, governing myself, etc.  Like Oz said, the academics learned - for me- translated into almost nothing.  My degree just kind of indicated that I had an ability to learn - which is a good asset to have.  But the self-knowledge was fantastic.
 
under new management
last edited on Feb. 24, 2012 8:03AM
Kroatz at 9:26AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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There is a big difference between hearing and listening, that's why they are called differently. I was trying to support the initial point, not serve as a bad example. Everything would be much easier if people used the correct terms for what they were trying to say. Which I did. Everything would also become much easier if people understood the correct terms, which you apparently didn't.
 
Meh, I don't really care if people listen to what I say, it does not change what I said, it does not affect my opinion, it only affects the amount of knowledge my conversational partners have. If you do not LISTEN but only HEAR, then you do not LEARN but only waste time.
Comidion.deviantart.com
Ironscarf at 9:43AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Ayesinback proffered - @Hippie, if you can swing it at all, I hope you'll go live on campus at a college/uni. It can seem daunting at first, but attending college for me was most valuable from the social standpoint – making a new community for myself, governing myself, etc. Like Oz said, the academics learned - for me- translated into almost nothing. My degree just kind of indicated that I had an ability to learn - which is a good asset to have. But the self-knowledge was fantastic.
  

And don't forget the sheer entertainment value of it all. For instance, one of the guys on my course used to decorate his clothes with spray paint every morning - after putting them on.
This is him on guitar with his band Gaye Bykers On Acid (occasionally Lesbian Dopeheads On Mopeds) and the vid shows a typical morning in our college refectory:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c09eHP_Z9mk
 
last edited on Feb. 24, 2012 9:48AM
Banes at 10:43AM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Kids usually seem BETTER at listening than adults. In older people, it's kind of special when youengage with a good listener/responder.

It's a great thing to try and impart to your kids, to be able to listen well. Listening even seems strongly related to EMPATHY, maybe an even greater quality to have (and one that some say, is on the decline in younger generations).

Man, it can be frustrating to be trying to engage with someone who's obviously distracted/uninterested/not listening (more and more common in a world of increasing distractions!). And how great when someone's there with you, and present in the moment.

Interesting point by Bravo about the other side of that…just agreeing to everything and being a yes man. I, uh…well, yes. I agree.
last edited on Feb. 25, 2012 7:50AM
bravo1102 at 1:17PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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ayesinback wrote:
  
 I think we agree, but I happen to reverse the two words.  Someone who politely sits and listens while I bounce my words off them is listening, but I feel, like Oz where i'm simply lecturing.  On the other hand, someone who actually hears what I'm saying can't help but act engaged.   
The actual clinical definition of “hearing” versus “listening” is as Genejoke used them.  Yes, this is all based on countless clinical studies of people's listening skills.  You don't think I just pulled this out of my ass because I like to lecture? 
 
Listening skills are actually taught in various places featuring continuing education and those trying to help the socially inept and mentally ill.  I fall into the last catagory and various health care professionals praised my listening skills.  I praised my mother who unknowingly practiced them and from whom I learned.  I also learned the pain one can cause when one only hears and doesn't listen.  It can lead to an entire life lived in never ending frustration and what I call “The Cassandra Complex”  Cursed to forever being right but to never be listened to.
 
All people have their belief systems and their coping mechanisms and woe to one who challenges them.  People will dig in their heels because their sacred cow is untouchable.  No amount of evidence and reason will sway them and that is a lesson hard and long in the learning.  Someone has to want to change their mind and willing to listen to alternatives before a lesson can be learned.  I remember teaching human evolution and the students looking at me and simply saying they were good Christians and knew evolution was wrong but would study it to pass the test.  It wouldn't have mattered if I had brought them the fossils and DNA samples and even the entire Leakey Clan to lecture to them. (Let alone Richard Dawkins!)  Their mind was made up before they sat in the classroom though they did admit I made a convincing argument.  Though I did change one or two minds and that's what a teacher does.
 
One never stops learning and should be open to learning from anyone and anything.  That means one has to know how to listen rather than hear.
 
(Copies of this lecture are not available on CD and do not look for my forthcoming book “Enough about me, let's talk about me : The Cassandra Complex and the art of Listening”
last edited on Feb. 24, 2012 1:19PM
rokulily at 1:44PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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sigh- when i heard that my class was canceled for saturday i was yay! weekend to relax and get myself healthy. then i get an email from my art history professor… you've enough rest, time for required museum visit this sunday! this would be all spiffy and fine if i wasn't feeling sick. eh, it'll be an adventure.
 
 —-
conversation about listening based off of relationship woes, eh? hippievan, it's not like you won't find someone just because you've interesting interests- to have implied so was wrong on your sisters behalf. it just means that you might have your work cut out for you as a smart, interesting, and (i think) shy person. and true, the ability to listen is a valuble tool in any relationship really- but so is the confidence to put out your ideas for others to sometimes listen to. which i think you have some of as you talked to an older gentleman about toothbrushes- so don't shirk away from that just cause your sister said something mean.
 —-
kroatz. language is an evolution and as such i like to compare language with a species counterpart. simple words are simple organisms, old unused words are dinosaurs, words that have prevailed for long admounts of time are sharks and crocodiles, words that have changed only a bit but have been around for a long time are birds and fish. words that have faded out are more recently extinct speices… and so on and so forth.
 —-
i am unwell
 
ayesinback at 4:00PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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bravo1102 wrote:
The actual clinical definition of “hearing” versus “listening” is as Genejoke used them.  Yes, this is all based on countless clinical studies of people's listening skills.  You don't think I just pulled this out of my ass because I like to lecture? 
  
I stand corrected. And it serves as case in point of why I keep coming back to defining terms. I agreed with the concept but have been guilty of exchanging the two terms.

But that's enough about me. You had a question, didn't you. I hope I'm not so dense as to have misunderstood this, too.


Anyway, do I think you pulled this out your ass?


This? Do i think you pulled THIS out your ass?


No


Not THIS.
under new management
last edited on Feb. 24, 2012 4:30PM
lba at 4:45PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Oooh, semantics and stuff. Yeah, I'm too brain-dead for that stuff.
Anyhoo, whatup. Pokin' my head in, been gone for 2 years, yadda yadda, all that good stuff. Board seems pretty much like the old days. Heck, pretty much 90% of the regular people I remember are still here, except that now they're mods. Go figure.
HippieVan at 9:33PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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rokulily wrote:
conversation about listening based off of relationship woes, eh? hippievan, it's not like you won't find someone just because you've interesting interests- to have implied so was wrong on your sisters behalf. it just means that you might have your work cut out for you as a smart, interesting, and (i think) shy person. and true, the ability to listen is a valuble tool in any relationship really- but so is the confidence to put out your ideas for others to sometimes listen to. which i think you have some of as you talked to an older gentleman about toothbrushes- so don't shirk away from that just cause your sister said something mean.
 —-
i am unwell

I was mostly joking, really. I imagine being in school will expose me to some people who share my interests.
I usually find it relatively easy to talk to people once I've got an excuse to do so, it's more the initial starting of a conversation that I have trouble with.

Feel better!
 

 
I was just thinking back on how scared Juliet used to be. For ages she wouldn't even come close to me. I would just sit in the room with her a couple hours a day and do my homework or whatever quietly, and let her hop around and get used to my presence. After a little bit she would take treats from my hand. I moved her into my room because she was eating too many cords and not getting enough attention in the rec room. Then I had to get her properly litter trained and stop her from eating everything so her free time wouldn't be too destructive.
A year later she's got free range of my room - she gives kisses, comes to her name, does simple tricks to get treats, and I've even gotten her to stop chewing the walls.
 
Now, there's no way getting another person to like me can be harder than all that. ;) 
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ozoneocean at 9:56PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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lba wrote:
except that now they're mods. Go figure.
You would be too! …Welcome back lba. Good to see you again!
 
Actually, with the site only half finished like it is in this new version, only Skool and I are really mods and admins now. Lucky the forums are so quiet now or we'd be totally buggered.
 
———
 
I have FINISHED my latest comic page! The only trouble is that the sound effects are being a pain. I finished the page on Tuesday. That's how long the text stage has stumped me. Grrrr!!!!!!!
 
ozoneocean at 10:30PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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Ironscarf wrote:
  This is him on guitar with his band Gaye Bykers On Acid (occasionally Lesbian Dopeheads On Mopeds) and the vid shows a typical morning in our college refectory:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c09eHP_Z9mk

 
Ha, yeah there were some interesting characters in my art school too… at uni there were more posers than characters, but art school had the real thing :)
Speaking of bands, a guy who I shared a studio with had a pretty good one, called Effigy. He went to the same art school as me (I didn't know him then), did pretty well with his band and then went back to being an artist- that's when I shared the studio with him.
 
This is my fave song by them:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzInIxxR9OE
 
These are some more pro clips:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ix2_L-jVKw0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShKivQ4LkQY&feature=related
 
I didn't even know he'd been a musician though till another person in the studio told me one day.  And this is actually the first time I've actually looked up his vids too!
 
Strnage- when I knew him he was an ordinary blokey Aussie guy, with short hair, always in jeans and a ratty T-shirt, and also one amazing master of a painter.
Those vids are a complete contrast to the Mike Hardman I knew, he's so efiminate and dressy there, looks like they had a bit of a Placebo thing going on.
 
lba at 11:28PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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ozoneocean wrote:
 
 You would be too! …Welcome back lba. Good to see you again!
 
Actually, with the site only half finished like it is in this new version, only Skool and I are really mods and admins now. Lucky the forums are so quiet now or we'd be totally buggered.
    Yeah. I don't know how long my reappearance is going to last. The story of my disappearance is kind of a long tale, but it ends in me leaving for further combat training and officer candidate school some time in the next few months. It'd make for a pretty good comic if I should ever get around to it.
Ideally I'll not be going poof for another two years. It's rather nice to know DD and some of the old crew is still here though. That's does indeed warm my heart. 

I kind of like this new incarnation of the site too, I admit though that I'm a bit disappointed to see the boards so slow. 
last edited on Feb. 24, 2012 11:30PM
ozoneocean at 11:55PM, Feb. 24, 2012
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They slowed down mainly because of the incomplete functionality on the site that doesn't encourage people to hang around as much- weird JavaScript forum text entry forms, no stats on comics, no PQ notifications and so on.
 
By aaaanyway, Congrats on the officer training thing man! Wow! last time you were around you were just getting a BIG graphic design contract from a bank or something and also making noises about going off and maybe joining the army to pay the bills.
So what happened?
 
If you've got them, add me on Google+ https://plus.google.com/111477130608520952736/posts
or facebook: http://www.facebook.com/ozoneocean
 
I'd love to stay in touch!
 

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